Mr.Jizay: You must make a distinction between what our government does & what our soldiers do...you see, wars are primarily fought for profit, by the poor for the rich, and, most time, for nebulous reasons, which when examined in the light of day show them to be lies, and are used to justify this profit making venture...this is reinforced in the public mind by the press/media...whatever the real reasons for our involvement in Iraq, and there are many that can be speculated upon, the result has been the destruction of what was once a relatively prosperous, and I might add, secular Middle Eastern state, with a sizable middle-class...this was done by OUR government in the name of 'spreading democracy'...people who criticize our government do not hate the American nation or people, they merely hate the gangster actions of our ruling Elite,
whose actions are as bad as & worse than the actions of the latest 'Hitler', namely Saddam Hussein...or, I forget, the new 'Hitler' is the Iranian president...it's 'Hitler' of-the-Week'...our Founding Fathers never approved of foreign wars-for-profit, slaughter of civilian populations, torture, or systematic violations of people's God-given human rights...these actions are those committed by tyrants...it is hard for most US citizens to stomach
a return to this kind of barbarism.

Well, I'm speaking to a broader form of thinking brought on by capitalist culture and that's to think only for the short-term.

Indeed, as the poster is just that. He's repeating a party line, while I am quite original.

Meanwhile, would it be too much trouble to tell us what Cheney said in a nutshell. I'm not a fan of watching videos.

here is a transcript:

Q: Do you think the U.S., or U.N. forces, should have moved into Baghdad?
A: No.
Q: Why not?
A: Because if we’d gone to Baghdad we would have been all alone. There wouldn’t have been anybody else with us. There would have been a U.S. occupation of Iraq. None of the Arab forces that were willing to fight with us in Kuwait were willing to invade Iraq.
Once you got to Iraq and took it over, took down Saddam Hussein’s government, then what are you going to put in its place? That’s a very volatile part of the world, and if you take down the central government of Iraq, you could very easily end up seeing pieces of Iraq fly off: part of it, the Syrians would like to have to the west, part of it — eastern Iraq — the Iranians would like to claim, they fought over it for eight years. In the north you’ve got the Kurds, and if the Kurds spin loose and join with the Kurds in Turkey, then you threaten the territorial integrity of Turkey.
It’s a quagmire if you go that far and try to take over Iraq.
The other thing was casualties. Everyone was impressed with the fact we were able to do our job with as few casualties as we had. But for the 146 Americans killed in action, and for their families — it wasn’t a cheap war. And the question for the president, in terms of whether or not we went on to Baghdad, took additional casualties in an effort to get Saddam Hussein, was how many additional dead Americans is Saddam worth?
Our judgment was, not very many, and I think we got it right.

Ha, that's great.

We were afraid of winning back then, and now we go back in without the will or plan to succeed. We've got quite a thing going on here.

Yes the one word post "Dumb." was incredibly insightful and VERY articulately argued. Well done.

__________________
A song that says it all.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BqITJFGyq4s

I don't think so.

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Do you have a specific idea for success in Iraq? If you've already presented it in another thread i'd be happy to read it if you'd provide the link.

You'll have to forgive my naivete but your politics sound a lot like the big 3 fascists of WWII and having read some of your other posts sound like a strange blend of Stalinism and Nazism.

I'm just wondering, in "striking fear" in a population how much of a population can you kill before you've gone too far? It's a serious question. If you understand what democracy means then you must also understand the obvious conflicts that arise when you force a people to be democratic through a terror campaign.

Blah, blah, blah.

Just make sure you tune in to Jon Stewart tonight to get your latest news.

That's your word against mine.

Not a good case.



The real me.