Chavez pushes constitutional reforms in Venezuela - Page 18 - PhillyBlog

eldondre · #**171** (**permalink**) 07-02-2007, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheAdlerian

http://www.progressive.org/mag_intv0706

You’d think George Bush would get down on his knees and kiss Hugo Chávez’s behind. Not only has Chávez delivered cheap oil to the Bronx and other poor communities in the United States. And not only did he offer to bring aid to the victims of Katrina. In my interview with the president of Venezuela on March 28, he made Bush the following astonishing offer: Chávez would drop the price of oil to $50 a barrel, “not too high, a fair price,” he said—a third less than the $75 a barrel for oil recently posted on the spot market. That would bring down the price at the pump by about a buck, from $3 to $2 a gallon.

A very interesting article.

I won't go into defending Bush who is as bad for our country as he is for Chavez, there are some plroblems with Chavez's boasts. First and foremost, Chavez can't fix the price of oil. He coudl give us a sweetheart deal, but is he likely to actually sell the US oil at below market prices? no. VZ doesn't seem to have the capacity to produce enough to do so despite how much oil is in the ground. Additionally, Chavez, like other OPEC nations, have a balance they want to keep. They want oil prices high to as to finance their governments but low enough they don't spur investment in alternative energies (thus killing the long term viability of their product.

Quote:

The loss of so many skilled oil workers has hit PdVSA hard. (See related article.) Since Mr. Chávez took power in 1999, Venezuela's oil production -- according to U.S. government statistics -- is down to 2.4 million barrels a day, from 3.1 million barrels a day, despite high prices. (Venezuela has consistently accused the U.S. of undercounting PdVSA's production in recent years.)

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1182...N=wsjie/6month

speaking of Katrina:

Quote:

June 26, 2007 -- Americans gave nearly $300 billion to charity last year - a record, despite the 2005 total's boost from aid to victims of hurricanes Katrina, Rita and Wilma and the Asian tsunami.
Donors contributed an estimated $295.02 billion in 2006, up from $283.05 billion in '05.
Excluding disaster relief, the sum rose by an inflation-adjusted 3.2 percent, says an annual report released yesterday by the Giving USA Foundation.
Giving historically tracks the economy's health, with the rise amounting to about a third of that of the stock market, according to Giving USA. Last year's biggest chunk, $96.82 billion, or 32.8 percent, went to religious groups. The second-biggest, $40.98 billion, or 13.9 percent, was donated to colleges and libraries.

http://www.nypost.com/seven/06262007...ionalnews_.htm

Quote:

GDP (2006): $169 billion.
Annual growth rate (2006): 10.3%.
GDP per capita (2006): $6,250.
Government expenditures: 32% of GDP.
Natural resources: Petroleum, natural gas, coal, iron ore, gold, diamonds, bauxite, other minerals, hydroelectric power.
Petroleum industry (15 % of GDP): Oil refining, petrochemicals.
Manufacturing (17% of GDP): Types--iron and steel products, paper products, aluminum, textiles, transport equipment, consumer products.
Agriculture (3% of GDP): Products--corn, sorghum, rice, bananas, vegetables, coffee, beef, pork, milk, eggs, fish.
Trade: Exports (2006)--$64.5 billion: petroleum ($ 57.8 billion), aluminum, steel, chemical products, iron ore, cigarettes, plastics, fish, cement, and paper products. Major markets (2005)--U.S. 57.5%, the Netherlands 5.2%, Mexico, 4.5%, Colombia 4.5%. Imports (2006)--$31.3 billion: consumer goods, machinery and transport equipment, manufactured goods, construction materials. Major suppliers (2006)--U.S. 30.2%, Brazil 10.1, Colombia 9.9%, Mexico 6.8%, China 6.7%.
Exchange rate (Jan. 2007): 2,150 bolivars=U.S. $1.

http://www.traveldocs.com/ve/economy.htm

#**172** (**permalink**) 07-02-2007, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eldondre

I won't go into defending Bush who is as bad for our country as he is for Chavez, there are some plroblems with Chavez's boasts. First and foremost, Chavez can't fix the price of oil. He coudl give us a sweetheart deal, but is he likely to actually sell the US oil at below market prices? no. VZ doesn't seem to have the capacity to produce enough to do so despite how much oil is in the ground. Additionally, Chavez, like other OPEC nations, have a balance they want to keep. They want oil prices high to as to finance their governments but low enough they don't spur investment in alternative energies (thus killing the long term viability of their product.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1182...N=wsjie/6month

speaking of Katrina:

http://www.nypost.com/seven/06262007...ionalnews_.htm
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http://www.traveldocs.com/ve/economy.htm

I'm not following you logic there.

If they have more that SA then they will be able to control price. They're in business now and usually as one gains capital, one expands. That means better refineries over time. If a positive form of socialism is created, then that will attract workers to the refinery who will get paid well and have a good life for their family.

That's the model for many countries in the mideast.

Meanwhile, if deals are made with the US, then you'll have the biggest enemy paying you to build your country in the opposite direction, which is amusing. Really though, they could make the same deal with oil hungry China, and their economy will get much better. If China decides to make high quality goods at a low price, then they'll destroy the west. I think they already made an iphone clone before it even came out if they can do stuff like that and avoid the poison toothpaste, then.

Things like that will make it very tough for our capitalists to make billions and will really change things for us.

eldondre · #**173** (**permalink**) 07-02-2007, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheAdlerian

I'm not following you logic there.

If they have more that SA then they will be able to control price. They're in business now and usually as one gains capital, one expands. That means better refineries over time. If a positive form of socialism is created, then that will attract workers to the refinery who will get paid well and have a good life for their family.

That's the model for many countries in the mideast.

unless those companies exist to feed redistributionist policies rather than reinvestment. then the possibility exists that money that should be reinvested in plant and equipment is being spent to shore up political support. It is speculated that this problem is also occurring in the Middle East but those countries are vague about production and capital investment (and can be since they don;t hit the debt markets). And until the positive form of socialism is created, PVDSA is reportedly having managerial troubles because Chavez fired the experienced executives and replaced them with people who would do his bidding. experienced engineers are gold in Canada, which as oil deposits similar to Venezuela (heavy oil, sands deposits). Canda has a labor shortage in oil rich Alberta, esp experienced workers. how much of an impact this ultimately has, though, remains to be seen.

Quote:

The 45-year-old engineer is part of a swelling colony of Venezuelan expats who say they were driven into exile by a hostile government. Many assert they were purged after a long strike in 2002 at Petróleos de Venezuela SA, the state-owned oil giant known as PdVSA. More recent arrivals initially found work with private oil companies operating in Venezuela in 2003, but lost their jobs this year when Hugo Chávez wrested control of the companies' holdings. They call themselves the "twice fired."..Frigid, remote Alberta has become one of the world's fastest growing enclaves of Venezuelans, rivaling such warm-weather spots as Weston, Fla., outside Miami; and Sugar Land, Texas, near Houston. There are now 3,000 Venezuelan-Albertan families, up from 800 or so last year. Some Albertans now call Evergreen, a Calgary housing development, "Vene-green" because of the 100 families who have bought split-level homes there, and dangle Venezuelan flags from car rearview mirrors...
After Pedro Pereira lost his job directing Venezuela's petroleum technology center following the 2002 PdVSA strike, he fielded offers to return to the Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory in California, where he had been a research fellow in the 1980s.
But he chose the University of Calgary. Over the past five years, he's received $5 million from the Alberta Ingenuity Fund, a provincial program for scientific ventures, to develop advanced methods of extracting bitumen from oil-sand deposits. Canada's liberal immigration rules also let him recruit colleagues, and Canadian firms often hired the spouses of academics he hired, increasing family salaries

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1182...N=wsjie/6month

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheAdlerian

Meanwhile, if deals are made with the US, then you'll have the biggest enemy paying you to build your country in the opposite direction, which is amusing. Really though, they could make the same deal with oil hungry China, and their economy will get much better. If China decides to make high quality goods at a low price, then they'll destroy the west. I think they already made an iphone clone before it even came out if they can do stuff like that and avoid the poison toothpaste, then.

Things like that will make it very tough for our capitalists to make billions and will really change things for us.

The capitalist revolution is in full swing in China. In late 19th c and early 20th c trademark and patent "fraud" was widespread. read about the arly film industry. One of Philadelphia's original famed filmmaker's made money by finding out about a competitor's film and making his own version and beating them to the theaters (Lubin Film Co.). Edison Trust was in court for years because people were constantly using his patents without paying him. The iphone is most likely made in China. Asia is the present and future of the capitalist revolution at the moment. At any rate, giving China a special deal would be a great boon to China, not to Venezuela. Chavez woudl be foregoing income that woudl otherwise go to his country to China which woudl be translated into profits for Chinese companies. the only real benefit for VZ would be watching the US suffer....or worse, watch them find an alternate source of energy. Worse still, as long as our capitalists see these changes, it would only hurt the American worker as the capitalists can invest their capital in China and Canada and earn a profit on Venezuela's deal.