I prefer the parts of the neighborhood south of Walnut, but we have a friend who bought on the south side of the 4400 block of Sansom and is really happy. Lots of the houses are getting redone, and she was able to get everything super-modern, which is what she wanted. Not my preference, but she wasn't interested in the older Victorians that predominate south in the neighborhood. And she thinks the blocks there are not that bad and are improving.

But...and this is a big but...she was buying specifically to be in the Penn Alexander district. Buying a house on the north side of the street doesn't make sense to me for a family with a soon-to-be-school-age kid. Not a slam against the Powell School, but there's a reason why people pay a premium to be in the Penn-Alexander district.

Generally I think it's a good neighborhood to live in, as you describe your wants. Plenty of Penn folks with kids and more all the time, though many still live in Center City or on the Main Line. Convenient, good parks, lots of fun stuff going on for little kids.

Also generally, I would never buy a house sight unseen. The money you spend on a plane flight to scout the area will be more than worth it, if it saves you from getting scammed.

I work for O'Donnell so of course I am biased. And thanks wysong for the recommendation. I don't want to talk poorly about other realtors, and I deal with PFR agents all the time. Most of the are fine realtors, but there are about a million of them so if you go with a PFR agent, find someone good, because there are alot who just got their license and know little about real estate or UCity. And the PFR site just piggybacks off of www.realtor.com - it is the same site. PFR has no more to do with it than any other company. But getting back to the thread- the block seems a little pricy to me considering what it was very recently. But you could say the same thing about half of the city. The block has not had five of six renovations but about half the block, maybe thirty houses have been rehabbed there. And I have been inside a few of them and they did a good job. As far as what has been said about the Penn Sadie Alexander school I would agree with it. For many buyers that is the first thing on their list. And lastly I think buying a house sight unseen is really not a great idea. Even with Virtual Tours of the inside and outside - I would want to visit the neighborhood.

I grew up on the Main Line and I live in Center City. I don't know Swarthmore but it seems like a nice area. If I had to recommend UCity over the other areas besides the Penn Alexander school I would point out it's diversity, the big beautiful houses, the value, the suburban feel while still being minutes from Center City. The only thing I could say againist Center City is it has gotten too expensive. And if I had to say something againist the Main Line - I would say it is too expensive, too homogenous, and too boring. But you should be happy in any of these areas.

I'm going to repeat everybody's comments on the catchment district. The fact that Penn is planning to partner with Microsoft to do a similar "international sutdies" high school in the next 3 years supposedly, probably with a nearly identical catchment area is one more reason to look carefully at those catchment borders - very carefully.

To be clear those blocks of Sansome were always kind of an unexpectedly bad pocket in the area stemming especially from 2 drug houses (now gone and rehabbed) on the 4400 block of Sansome. Its hard to describe hwo dramaticly different and recent the changes on the 4400 block of Sansome feel right now and the 4500 block is still much more "in progress". Everything (except the newly announced homeless shelter) indicates that the 4400 and 4500 block of Sansome will continue to improve dramatically in the near future, but its still pretty speculaltive right now.

If you are going to spend that kind of cash and are willing to go outside of the catchment area - there are a bunch blocks that are already much, much more solid with large trees and beautiful architecture south and west of there in Garden Courts and Cedar Park.

Thanks again for the informative discussion about the catchman district, the even and odd number difference in the Sansome street, the neighborhood, and the suggestion for a real estate broker. In one day, I received more information than I had for weeks by searching the web. I love phillyblog!

It looks as if the market has changed suddenly. We are going to put our house on the market next week. It used to be in our neighborhood that houses were on the market for less than two weeks and people were bidding over the asking price. My real estate agent had an open house last weekend and she received no offer yet, which is very unusual. Hopefully we will sell our house well and find something nice in Philadelphia.

Again. I appreciate very much the discussion about the 4500 block Sansom street. Please keep us updated about the development in the area.
Best regards,

Where are you coming from?

There's no substitute for scoping out the place for yourself. If you're going to take the big step of relocating from the West Coast you definitely want to wander the neighborhood for yourself. I second the south of Walnut vote. I prefer north of Baltimore. East of 41st is too undergradish (noisy during the semester). West of 46th is kind of sketchy - your mileage may vary.

Philly really is very block by block.

My take is that while I wouldn't especially want to live on Baltimore, there are quite a few really good blocks south of it (as well as north). And depending on the street, there are some excellent blocks in the 4700, 4800 4900 range. Again, it varies street by street. The 4700 block of Windsor (not where I live) though both south of Baltimore and west of 46th Street and out of the cachement is probably one of the best blocks in the neighborhood. Except for the lack of parking. On the other hand there are some of the 4300 blocks that I personally wouldn't prefer to live on.

So it's complicated, at least until you start walking around and talking to people.

I would second that there are some really great blocks in the 4600-4900 range, particularly on some of the smaller streets (like GPD's). The new director of the UCD bought a house on the 4600 block of Springfield (which is both South of Baltimore and obviously west of 46th) - if that says anything.

Just to be clear, I don't live on the 4700 block of Windsor, the one I mentioned. I don't want anybody to think I'm just trying to promote my block. I do think, from observing friends who live there, that it is probably the best quality of life block in the neighborhood, or close to it, despite the fact that it's south of Baltimore and west of 46th. Aside from parking, maybe.

I live north of Baltimore and west of 46th. And lived before east of 46th, on a block that was also two-story early 20th century rowhouses. I find the block I'm on now--west of 46th--to be notably better than the one I was on before--east of 46th. Fewer renters, better community spirit. Of course I don't have a child. If I did, it's possible that it'd be worth it for me to move back to the less-desirable block east of 46th to be in the cachement. But for now I'm actually happier west of 46th.

Anyway, it's just a way of saying it's complex. There are good reasons for the conventional wisdom about staying east of 43rd or 46th or 48th or 50th or whatever street people name, but there are also quite a few blocks west even of 48th street that are fine places to live...and better than quite a few of the blocks closer to campus. For one thing, there's much less trash and noise, since the block is more families (and elderly people) instead of college kids.

Anyway, people should see for themselves what they like and feel comfortable with. The reality is often more complex than any kind of conventional wisdom can summarize.