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07-12-2008, 03:05 AM
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Which is ok. Your faith made you a better man. But in the end that's what it boils down to... "there has just gotta be..." Which is the Intelligent Design argument... rainbows are amazing... there has got to be a "Painter", the X-Files argument... which I subscribe to... there is NO proof of alien life other than the fact that our Universe is megaginormous. So I believe in extra terrestrial life simply because... there has GOT to be more life in this Universe than just on this one tiny planet. 
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07-13-2008, 05:57 AM
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I was reading about Tony Snow which brought a question to my mind... when someone is considered by modern science to be incurable and yet they live... it's a miracle by God, correct? As per our earlier discussion.
What of the inverse? If someone is deemed to be cured yet dies? Logically, shouldn't a supernatural cause be attached?
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07-14-2008, 07:54 PM
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Which is more naive- to believe in a higher power beyond what is scientifically provable or to believe that anything that is not presently scientifically provable either does not exist or is not important?
My belief is not based on any sort of fairy tale or intelligent design- just as science is limited to finite, woefully incomplete human knowledge. I think it is possible to be a good person without spiritual belief- I just imagine it must be a very incomplete existence that lacks the depth to wonder at truths beyond what we know (and can presently prove) to be fact. Extraterrestrial life? Who knows- it is possible. The point is there is more to our existence and reality than cosmic chance. That is what I believe. I respect people who don't have any belief beyond quantifiable knowledge and reason or see any greater power or purpose at work in the universe. Quote:
__________________
Peace, John My eBay World My Librarything MySpace . . . . "The brick walls are not there to keep us out. The brick walls are there to give us a chance to show how badly we want something.
Because the brick walls are there to stop the people who don’t want it badly enough.”" -Randy Pausch, from "Achieving Your Childhood Dreams," also known as The Last Lecture
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07-15-2008, 04:25 AM
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Here is an analogy that I think works... two people at a club... one sober, one drunk. Both having a great time. The person with the altered reality is arguably having a more intense time but the sober person doesn't need the booze to have fun.
That's how I see your reality being different than mine. We're at the same club but you have something extra going on that is giving your time on this planet a little extra umph. When I was on mushrooms or acid I certainly felt "depth". I felt one with the Universe and had a deeper connection to ALL. But I don't feel a lacking when I am sober. I do envy your extra layer of "truth" just like I might envy someone who is really getting jiggy on the dancefloor due to an extra shot of Tequila. Doesn't mean I'm going to belly up to the bar and order a round for myself.
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07-15-2008, 06:47 PM
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I think I can appreciate where you are coming from, but having belief in a higher power/divine source of ultimate meaning is a lot different than being drunk. It is a willingness to reach beyond the humanly quantifiable to the greater source of life as we know it.
If you say that you believe we are all here solely because of some big bang and random mutation/evolution of living organisms into human life and the world and universe as we know it- I respect that- but personally I believe there is more to the story- a higher power/divine being that purposed all this- that's all. I still believe evolution and scientific discovery - I just believe there is more.... Quote:
__________________
Peace, John My eBay World My Librarything MySpace . . . . "The brick walls are not there to keep us out. The brick walls are there to give us a chance to show how badly we want something.
Because the brick walls are there to stop the people who don’t want it badly enough.”" -Randy Pausch, from "Achieving Your Childhood Dreams," also known as The Last Lecture Last edited by peacemover : 07-15-2008 at 06:53 PM.
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07-19-2008, 08:31 PM
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John 2:13
And the Jews' passover was at hand, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem. 14 And found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the changers of money sitting: 15 And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers' money, and overthrew the tables; 16 And said unto them that sold doves, Take these things hence; make not my Father's house an house of merchandise. This passage has a wider meaning than just driving the merchants from the temple...God made this world to be a place of prayer to Him and a place of meditation and peace...But what have we done?...WE have turned it into 'a house of merchandise'...a 'dollar store'! Yet, fear not, because if we come to Him there is no worry: Are not five sparrows sold for two cents? And yet not one of them is forgotten by God. Indeed, the very hairs of your head are all numbered. Do not fear; you are worth more than many sparrows. Luke 12:6-7 Last edited by frankdialogue : 07-19-2008 at 08:36 PM.
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07-20-2008, 04:16 AM
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07-20-2008, 08:52 AM
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A question that bothers me anytime I think about war... how is it that people who believe in God can ignore his 5th commandment?
Shouldn't they be afraid for their very souls? And by ignoring the 5th (or any commandment) are they not blatantly expressing their lack of faith?
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