Originally Posted by alesis

Yeyyyy! The bi-monthly I hate south street thread.

I hate the crappy stores on south street-oh, except this one, and that one, oh and that place over there, and a few restaurants off of south street which don't count, event though the whole area is called "the south street headhouse district", oh and that one restaurant that is on south street.

When people talk about the good ol' days of south street, they were either drunk from the bars or a teenager buying clothes and eating pizza or ordering tea from philly pizza co.. Now that they are older, they hate the "teenager" stores and/or most bars.

The 80's were punk/new wave, and we had zipperhead, skins, trash and vaudeville, neo deco, etc. Today the equivalent is hiphop and urban, and the reflective stores are in this commercial district just like anywhere else.

Any typical commercial district targets teens-early twenties, because they are the biggest market in america.

Do I like junk jewelry? No. My wife might get one or two pieces a year since she doesn't have to be in Tiffany's or Henri David's every day. But there are plenty of stores for everyone, and anybody who doesn't realize this are certainly unrealistic in their wishes for south street. Center city has a borders because they have 1700 people walking past EVERY HOUR during the weekdays-such traffic would give the nimbys a heart attack; you can't have your cake and eat it, too.

Oh wait-you can! This is south street, part of the most walkable cities in america. I can go eat lunch at Bridget Foy's, get my coffee at the Bean, get comfortable shoes from Benjamin Lovell, go to my office and put my new shoes on, go to ritz camera, walk less than 10 blocks to Borders(or I could go to Headhouse Books and order anything I want). I can then go to Tiffany's to buy another $80 bookmark, then the coach store to buy a bag for all of those books I read but didn't buy at Borders-which is why south street doesn't have any book stores, yadayada, then walk down to Jones for an early dinner under the largest internet porno company in america, then old city for a martini at continental or a pabst at khyber, then back to Bridget Foy's for a night cap before I go home.

I've done that walk more times than I can count, which makes this the best city I've ever lived in. If there is such distain for the business climate around here, there are plenty of condos in center city, old city, eastfalls, mannyunk, et al. The simple reality is that the nuances of this area will never change for several reasons that are searchable in this forum.

Please tell me where else in philadelphia 4 "3 bell" restaurants, an independent wine store, several byobs, an award winning dance studio that has evening and weekend events(tonight society hill dance had a thriller dance party), a cute bookstore instead of a big box store that makes you want to buy books instead of coffee, tattoo and piercing shops, several indy record stores, sneaker stores, skateboard shops, bike shops, three fullsize grocery stores, a great camera store, and so much more, are so accesible?

People can complain, but there is absolutely no where else in Philadelphia that has such a diverse mix of stores.

Originally Posted by TopCat

Your post is somewhat accurate but doesn't tell the whole story. The South Street of the 80's was not much different than the South Street of today. However, the South Street of the 60's and 70's was way cooler than the South Street of the 80's.

South Street was like any other Philadelphia shopping district until the city announced plans in the 60's for the South Street Expressway. Property values plummeted and business's moved out. Landlords were forced to lower their rents while they fought against the expressway. (damned nimbys) These lower rents attracted artists, craftspeople and business's that catered to a younger crowd. (hippies) Throughout the 70's South Street flourished under the threat of demolition and became the coolest street in town.

In the early 80's the city scrapped plans for the expressway and the rents shot up again. This forced many people out and attracted a newer mix of retailers with deeper pockets. Including some national chains. They capitalized on the success of the bohemian counterculture of the 70's and they too flourished. Today we have a mixed menu from the cool 70's to modern vogue, with a side order of corporate america. There are a few moldy teeth, but nothing that can't be fixed.

In effect; South Street didn't come alive until it was pronounced dead. And it didn't start to die (in the eyes of some) until it was confirmed it would survive. But like it or not, it's still eclectically hip.

Originally Posted by Hospitalitygirl

Clap, clap, clap!

That's pretty much it, but some people are just never satisfied with these succinct answers, and thread persists much as the idiotic one in the NE section about the Orleans Theater becoming sec. 8 housing or a Wal-Mart, (unbunch your panties, neither is happening), and will continue to come out until everyone has every little whim satisfied at elbow's length.

I think we need to keep Alesis' and TopCat's answers on speedpost.

Originally Posted by thunda

Also, before complaining about those "junk shops," remember that South Street has some the highest retail rents in the city, only slightly lower than Rittenhouse Row.

Originally Posted by tbdiscovery

After having three bad experiences in a row with groups of AAs running their mouth at me and the former gf, I gave up on South St at night. And yes, in case you are wondering, she was dressed respectfully. And yes, on one instance a police officer was right there and said nothing.

I still love the area, and especially frequent Bainbridge, but some of the people need to be publicly hanged. Last I was on South St below 6th, it was punk suburban kids trying to be Jay Z and the common slobs trying to get themselves killed. I do miss Pizzeria Uno.

Originally Posted by Gladys Kravitz

This is THE answer to the topic of the post "Nervous about the state of South Street".... fear for your safety at night, especially weekends in warmer weather. I'm beginning to realize that changing the types of stores from cell phone and schlock jewelry stores to book stores and home furnishing stores may not be the answer. What has to change is the attraction of the Street to the current trash who parade up and down in their cars and on foot (often looking to be hit on by the vehicle occupants). The thugs who verbally assaulted your former GF probably were not spending any money at South Street's retail establishments. They were there to see and be seen (as scary a thought as the sight of them may be). Break that attraction and South Street will feel safe again.

Messing up their traffic patterns on weekend nights, better policing (there are lots of cops around, just too bad they stand around in groups oblivious to the crap going on around them), etc. could be solutions to explore. Also better enforcement of the 'block the box' and noise infractions could send a message. How about issuing tickets to vehicles stopping in the middle of South Street for two or three minutes for no other reason than to harass female pedestrians.

South Street has always been a place to see and be seen. But at least in the 70s 80s and most of the 90s you could see and be seen, shop, yet still feel safe and not be harassed.

Originally Posted by QVNewcomer

Yes, by all means: could we please start ticketing these darned Negroes for coming out at night? They're scaring all the white people!

Originally Posted by Malloy

What a worthless comment. Why the race bait? The 'scene' dramatically changes on South Street after say, 10PM. (esp on the weekends) Anyone who has ever spent more than a few days in the area knows it. Yes, the punks are mostly black...but that in itself means nothing. The issue is that they are punks who loiter and harass others walking by. Walk down South Street with an attractive g/f and get back to me.