What's the down low on the Bella Vista United Civic Association. What do they do? When do they meet, and is this a good organization to get involved with? How to they compare to BV Town Watch, or QVNA?

Thanks!

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"Stories are for eternity, when memory is erased, when there is nothing to remember except the story" -Tim O'Brien

Its pretty easy.

Since the people from the other thread won't bother to read this-I'll let you know an unbiased view of each organization. After this post you will probably receive various "Vern Sucks" and "Dicicco Sucks" verbiage that ruins any other political conversation on this blog.

Bella Vista United Civic Association is based on the auspice of Vern Anastasio and his affiliates, who wish to eventually win the 1st district city council position, and possibly mayor someday. Bella Vista Town Watch is a catagorical retort, sponsored, fed, but not led by the current citycouncilman Dicicco and his affiliates.

QVNA.org is based on people who have lived here for 6 months, failed to do their homework, and then complain about traffic, the least amount of crime in a city of 1.5 million, litter which is less than des moine, Iowa(even though they cause most of it by throwing their trash in public bins), parking when they live in the fifth(or sixth depending on the day) largest city, yet get a residential parking permit for only $35 a year instead of being forced to pay a second mortgage for a spot, and are located near more "three bell" restaurants than anywhere in the city while being able to enjoy the other, more spontaneous side of Philadelphia.

Its pretty complicated.
Welcome to philly.

If you contact BVTW.ORG enough of times, you get an angry retort from the "webmaster"that he wants his email off of the website, yadayadayada.

If you contact BVUCA.ORG you will get an angry retort from the "webmaster"that he wants his email off of the website, yadayadayada.

Meanwhile, the South Street Headhouse District is in the middle of all of them , representing the interests of businesses within a 40/sq. blk. area. They pay for the trash removal, mini-district, and several other programs that the local neighborhood disorganization's take credit for.

As you can see, despite the ignorant views of others on this board, I have no affinity for local groups that wish to discredit incoming businesses for no reason-I believe in taking an unbiased view of each proposal and supporting my views with facts instead of my own personal opinion.

Alot of talk and not enough action until its too late. Businesses open up, cause trouble, then each neighborhood assoc. responds with "this has been here for years, why didn't we know about it?!?!?" Meanwhile, each leader of each local group does business on or near south street, and should know about the coming's and going's if they wish to complain.

Main Entry: un·bi·ased Pronunciation: "&n-'bI-&st Function: adjective

1 : free from bias; especially : free from all prejudice and favoritism : eminently fair <an unbiased opinion>

using the word twice to bookend an agry rant does not compute

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SITUATION: MOISTURIZED
thor must be failing -

What's angry about it? I stated what each group is.
Each neighborhood group is related to polictical affiliation, otherwise they would not be able to get anything done. I just don't understand why people can't have a conversation without smearing Vern or Frank-I think they both do positive and negative things just as any other politician, and we should use the efforts of both to get our area in the best shape it can be.
In her posting title, she asked specifically about BVUCA.

I do have grievances with QVNA since they stick their nose in commercial zoning issues on opinion, not fact-yet do not pay for one dime of south street's budget, try to take credit for projects like the rennovated Bainbridge Greens, and then delay paperwork out of laziness for places like Ansill and Gayle, thereby costing them 10's of thousands worth of revenue which they had to smile about since one old rat on the board was too lazy to type a two sentence approval letter after they verbally approved the projects. I'd lived in QV for 10 years and cannot think of one positive thing they have done for anyone but the 12 or so people sitting on the board.

When I lived in BV I helped out at BVUCA events.

At least when I was there they had numerous events each year including the Christmas Tree Lighting and Trolley around BV to see all of the Christmas lights. They also got the Italian Market festival started again by having a BV Festival at the Italian Market to coincide with the procession of the saints. I think last year they just merged it into the Italian Market festival.

Who cares about the politics of individuals involved with the orgs so long as they are producing and care about the neighborhood.

-UC

I've not heard QVNA take credit for the re-greening of Bainbridge. The references I have heard from QVNA have clearly stated that South Street HH District has done the work. As for sticking its nose in commercial zoning, why shouldn't a neighborhood association be concerned about commercial development along 4th and 5th Streets that sticks its nose into our residential area? Don't get me wrong, I believe we need a healthy mix of commercial and residential development. I'm not one of those QVers who wish all the commercial properties would go away. But I am a QV resident who cares about what kind of businesses are in my neighborhood. No, I don't want any more store front Chinese (or any other ethnicities so as not to be called anti Asian) take outs or burger joints. No more cell phone stores, no more sneaker stores, and no more bars. I would love another book store, more interesting clothes stores (a la South Street of the 80s), gourmet shops, art galleries, BYOBs. We've had some great recent retail additions along 4th Street like the new salons, and there are great staples like Essene the Tea Shop, Frame store, etc. and 5th Street has a great potential to become a hipper "antiques row."

So, back to my point on QVNA, it is appropriate for the neighborhood association to have a say in the commercial realm. It's not OK to sit on approvals, essentially not doing what you were elected to do. I'm hearing of the Ansill and Gayle delays here for the first time and think that stuff is deplorable and what makes for bad relationships between a neighborhood association and they very types of businesses we need. BTW, I believe the old putz you are referring to is no longer on the board.

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If you can't serve as a good example, you'll just have to be a horrible warning.

In the QV Crier they didn't mention the SSHD, only that work was progressing on Bainbridge Green with Marie Lederer's help...Marie does deserve alot of credit since she got the money, but it was a formulation of SSHHD work. If you heard or saw them mention the South Street businesses, I apologize to you, but I saw what I saw.
They also, in an email blurb, mention the movie night at the headhouse without giving south street businesses any credit for it; they then began promoting another movie night at Mario Lanza which was also being held on Wednesday's.
I don't think its too smart to have similar, competing free events for residents.
I do not mean to sound rude towards you, as I am applying this to our fellow neighbors and not you.

This is why QVNA doesn't grasp the whole picture in regards to a business district. Business zoning issues need to be based on a well rounded experience, not the ignorant, opinionated decision based on the personal tastes of a few neighbors.

QVNA (and Society Hill Civic)says its our neighborhood, and slam just about anything that wants to move in or already exists on south street. They don't even know who they are representing since a majority of this area is rental properties with professional people who live here because of South Street's vitality and business mix. They are here for the daylife, nightlife, and everything inbetween.

A new chinese shop hasn't opened in 9 years. The last one to open was Rich City, in which they built a nice place out of a shell on 5th street, and their chef actually takes his time and makes better dishes than the sappy chinese that has been here for years. I hated generel tso's until I tasted his.

If you want more clothing stores (a la South Street of the 80s) then you are as old as I am. We wore that then. I don't wear what I did in the 80's, and I don't know of too many that would(unless I'm going to be Sid Vicious for Halloween) I like Human League, Mister Mister, and The Ramones, but if I opened up a shop selling this decade of music I think I would be closed in a month. Just because people remember it doesn't mean anyone is buying it today. The current mix of stores is what the new generation is wearing. 20 years from now, they will say they want south street to be the (ala South Street of the 2000's)! Other than jeans, I buy alot on south street, and I've never been accused of looking like a rap video-in fact, when I tell people I got this or that shirt on south street they act shocked. Why? Because they assume without trying.

South Street now has less cell phone stores than any other commercial districts in Philadelphia except for Mannyunk. I do not understand how everyone who doesn't want a cell phone store in their neighborhood has a cell phone. 185million subscribers, but no stores? South Street is down to 3 1/2 stores, which is about 3/4% of all the shops on south street.

Who doesn't want more ethnic restaurants? Wasabi House opened up recently as a welcome addition, and another success of how popular uptown businesses are trying out our area for growth. Chaleo Thai won "best of". Tamarind won "Best of". Alyan's won "Best of". Fez won "Best of". Marrakesh is the most sought after restaurant by tourists in our neighborhood according to market research. We have more 3 bell restaurants than any other neighborhood. Even if you don't like them all, its quite an achievement for our area, and the reason why people move here. In fact, one of my close friends said that the director of south street moved here because he received a mailer for a special at Bistro Romano. He never even knew of this area. They came down, ate, and after walking around decided that they loved they area so they bought a house in QV.

There are only 5 sneaker stores. Retail without sneakers is like making pancakes without flour. If people go to the gym, they need sneakers. Out for a walk? Sneakers. Garden work? Sneakers. Getting them from the Cherry Hill Mall doesn't make them better in any way, shape, or form. In fact, a pair I saw in a mall for $120 cost me $20 on a south street closeout deal, so I bought 2 pairs-I'm set for a year!hehe

I enjoy everthing else you mentioned-so does old city. Guess what? O.C. Retail and nightlife struggle during the week since it is a ghost town until the weekend. The galleries' hours are sporadic at best, and do not thoroughly contribute to the area as they once did. I've purchased 38 paintings this year, but haven't gone to First Friday in at least five years. Meanwhile, I only know of one person out of about 30-40 that regularly go First Friday and have bought artwork.
Without an appropriate mix of stuff you like, plus stuff I like, plus stuff that others like, there will be no commercial district-then there is no point to live in the city if there are no ammenities nearby.

Believe it or not, we do need more bars because the ones we had are dropping like flies due to landlord/tenant disputes. Even though places like Abilenes might not be one's hotspot to get a glass of wine, they did create a niche of live music that no one had, and they have never interfered with one QV or Society Hill resident; even so, it would be near impossible to get such a place approved in today's climate. If people wizzing in your neighborhood gotcha down-look at who is doing it. It is your own neighbor, and alot of times they are coming from Olde City or Center City, stop by south street for lorenzo's then are on their way home when they sprinkle our doors. I have a neighbor who works for the DA and is loud and drunk every weekend. Another neighbor who is a broker for a trading firm was wizzing in my courtyard after a night out (I saw him earlier by my shop). They are not in our neighborhood because they are getting their car. They live here. Most visitors don't even know this neighborhood exists! They stick to the main drag and barely even venture the side streets, which is why the side street retail rents are about a 1/5th of south street prices.

I sat in a community meeting one day where Cornelius-aka"Corky", acting as a QVNA commitee representative, insisted that there should be some way to buy out the leases of the tattoo shops so that they can be rid of for good. He said they sickened him when he would walk from his house to the convenience store, meanwhile, I know that 1)he has only lived here for a few years while tattoo shops have been here for over 20, and 2) since he is a close neighbor of mine I know that he walks down 3rd when he goes to the store. People like that don't even realize that Southwark and the latest dish are here directly because of this intrinsic mix-and once again, please show me one report where a tattoo shop has done anything but help our area.

Meanwhile, a woman wanted to develop the dalmation building-at last month's QVNA meeting they said they would approve it if it was ONLY residential...they forgot that unintellectual diatribes such as this just get thrown out in zoning hearings, because the law plainly states that first floor must be commercial. The lady took her project the first time with residential via QVNA's concerns and lost-she took it yesterday with first floor commercial(per law) and one. Another month of business, and one more mortgage payment wasted thanks to the ignorance of people who do what they can to throw a wrench into the works.

Yet they don't do a single thing about their own neighborhood. There are several people on this board who email me about questionable building violations that are seen in QV in regards to homes being built. I say"why don't you contact QVNA"...almost every single time the people say that they did, but QVNA did nothing about it.

Technically, this thought is incorrect. Please let me explain why before you think I'm nuts.

IF QVNA was only sponsored by the neighbors, I would partially agree with you; however, they are funded by the city as an N.A.C.. What's an N.A.C.?
A Neighborhood Advisory Committee is meant for low to moderate income areas to provide help on affordable housing and to rebuild our deteorated housing so that low to moderate income families can rent or buy. Yeah, my wizzing stock trading neighbor really needs that help. I don't know too many 650,000 homes for "low to moderate" income families.
Here is a link to what they should really be doing:
http://www.phila.gov/ohcd/RFPS.HTM
They are quite simply stealing grants from lower income areas that really need the money so that they can have a little clique that a majority of QV residents don't agree with. Northern Liberties uses the same funding, yet actually has an excuse since most of their neighborhood still looks like a bomb hit most of it.

The South Street Businesses have a municipality that is its own district. It raises money through taxes placed on each commercial property. In return, they clean the streets, provide a police station which also helps QV and Bella Vista, and create zoning decisions based on the laws within the Special Service District overlay. If someone lives within this immediate district, they certainly have the right to oppose a bar or restaurant that may be harmful to their way of life; but there is absolutely no way a takeout sushi bar, bar, or cell phone store on south street can affect a homeowner on 2nd and Christian.

Here's a story-please tell me if it makes any sense.
I always loved going to the camera store on 4th and Market. It was turned into a cell phone store. Under QVNA's thought and current state I should be able to have an effect, because I dont like cell phone stores. Now you may be thinking-why would I have anything to do with old city zoning. Well, since I live within Queen Village and the South Street Headhouse District, I could of had a direct effect on whether or not Crescent City on 9th and south got a liquor license, which is further from my home than the cell phone store on 4th and market! Under the current rationale, I should of been able to have a say on every liquor license in Olde city up to 4th and market since they are closer than the outskirt of the districts I live in. I have no business saying what old city does, just as I have no business saying what bar wants to open on 9th and south.

Downtown will never have a suburban feel, no matter how much QV wishes to kill business. I wish every business could magically disappear for just 1 week so QVNA would realize once and for all that their problems are from within, not from south street. Parking is a mess because single family homes have been turned into condos and apartments that now host as many as 8 cars per address. 99% of the trash is from neighbors who throw their residential waste into public receptacles. And crime is coming from our own residents who don't appreciate that they get to live in a decent neighborhood for$75/mo.

QVNA's actions are also unconstitutional under violation of the separation of powers, by assertion that they are acting under the executive branch by receiving OHCD funding for an N.A.C. to act as an extension of the Mayor's office, yet using that money to legistate through zoning, which is an extension of city council-OK, I know its a stretch, but if I ever get a chance to get my law degree I'm going to try it out...hehehe

The reality is that south street will never have everything a neighbor wants. The math will never support it. There are about 35,000 neighbors. Over 500 businesses. Rent is anywhere from 30-100/sq. ft. for a business. Areas like fabric row have lower rents which can more comforably hold businesses that cater to us- but no one, not even the coffee shops can afford to live off of only neighbors.

And yes, the one responsible for the Gayle delay is the person you think it is, but I don't have much confidence in his replacement.

Sorry for any typos-I'm in a hurry today!

I didn't take your post as rude. There are jerks in QV who would oppose anything just for the sake of opposing. We recently had a residential case where a guy wanted to clean up the ugliest property on the block with an attractive new fascade, and there was opposition. There is a fine line between the "public good" and individual liberty. If it's your property, you should be able to do what you want within reason.

I heard the credit given to SSHD for the re-greening of Bainbrifge at meetings. Just because the Crier doesn't specifically refer to SSHD, doesn't mean they are actually saying "we did it."

Probably am around your age, having been in my 20s in the 80s. Now, clearly I'm not in a time warp still running around in my Z Cavaruccis and parachute pants. And i'm not proposing that any retailer sell 80s stuff unless they're a vintage shop. I loved Aero, Neo Deco, etc. then, but I also love Fusion now and buy a lot of clothes there. What I meant by my "a la 80s" was the quality of the clothing stores and their offering alternative fashion, not just the same old mass produced garbage that fill the malls. How sad that we lost French Connection, another of my personal favs. I don't see how anyone can suggest that it or others like it priced itself off South Street when we now have an Addidas store with sneakers that cost nearly $200 and $100+ athletic pants. You make my point by relating that many people are surprised to find out that you got something nice on South Street. It was probably hard to find among so much crap which is the perception that a lot of people have of South Street today. Perceptions aren't just magically created, but rather based upon real observations. Your reference to the "appropriate mix" is just my point also. Right now, I don't think the mix is appropriate, but rather skewed in one direction. South Street is actually less diverse (in my opinion) in its ability to attract a wide variety of consumers who refuse to shop at malls than it was in the 80s or early 90s.

Maybe the issue is that those of us who loved the South Street of the 80s would like to still share the space with today's younger consumers. My personal reaction is that today's South Street is somewhat alienating toward me. I guess it's just the reality of crossing that magic 35 year old demographic. I'm no longer a retail target.

I love ethnic restaurants. I made the "ethnic" comment just so readers wouldn't think I was anti Chinese. In reality I wish we had lots more ethnic restaurants in our area. How about a nice little Indian restaurant that you can actually sit in and enjoy....

I'm also not saying that we don't need ANY sneaker or cell phone stores, but we certainly have more than enough by now. We certainly don't need MORE. BTW, I got my cell phone on-line, so I don't need a cell phone store. What we could use though is one that actually fixes cell phones on site.

Bars....... Just don't want any more like Ruby Tuesday's (i think it was there) where bouncers murder people. You're right, much of the undesireable actions like pissing and graffitti are inflicted by residents of this neighborhood. That's for a new and different thread.....

Oh, and tattoo stores, they've been around since who knows when, and actually are part of the fabric of South Street. They add interest because the last time I went to Cherry Hill mall (which was a long time ago and may have changed) I didn't see any tattoo stores there. What always made South Street attractive was that it was an ALTERNATIVE shopping district. Sadly it looks more and more like a mall taken apart and reconstructed on city street. There's very little left of the alternative feel of South Street. Happily the tattoo shops contribute to what remains.

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If you can't serve as a good example, you'll just have to be a horrible warning.

Neo Deco to Fusion-yep, were the same age...hehehe
I loved neo deco! They were really nice in there, and I think I shopped there at least once a week.

I think I understand when you say chinese...do you mean restaurants that do 80% of their business via takeout and have little concern of what their storefront looks like? I like some of South Garden's dishes but have never eaten in their since I feel like I'm in a 70's woodpanelled closet...hehe

I think that credit should be given in the Crier to south street, just as QV should get credit if they do something; this way neighbors will realize that the businesses do things for the community even if they don't see it.

I was amazed that French connection is gone from their home. Did you know the founder is from here, and now owns alot of the buildings on south street?

Traditional Indian food in a low key setting would be cool. Cedars is pretty good...what is that? I get them all mixed up. I know Fez is moroccan and Chaleo is Thai. How about Lavash? There pretty good.

Fat Tuesday's "killed" the guy by throwing him off of the balcony, but he's not dead, despite reports. I was actually talking to the police on 4th and south when it happened. The DA is actually reopening the case-I was with them last Saturday morning when they were taking measurements, etc. and they said the kid is alive and well, but has a few problems that will eventually go away.

The sprint store on 4th and south is fixing cell phones. So does the one on 7th or 8th and south.

I am a bit puzzled about that adidas store as well. What puzzled me even more was as soon as they opened every other sneaker store DOUBLED their adidas promotions. As a retailer, I would of said "if you want to be my cometition, I'm not carrying your stuff"...just my opinion, though.

Gotta go again...too many 20 min. meetings today.