I searched for the old thread re this development but I think it was lost with the shuffle.

To summarize, there was floated a proposal to build a 40-something story condo building at the old New Market site on Headhouse Square. Since then, the project has been more defined and the developer is now saying it'll be 20-something stories.

Anyway, as I predicted, the NIMBYs are all up in arms. Not only that, but one of them is preparing to match funds for fighting this proposal up to $100K. The basis for the fight? You guessed it, this city's ridiculous height restrictions! That site is zoned only for 11 floors.

http://citypaper.net/articles/2005-03-17/canon.shtml

While I do agree that having a tall building at that spot will be odd to say the least, it really isn't any taller than the Society Hill Towers where, I suppose, many of the NIMBYs live. Once again, this is true Philadelphian attempt to put the city in a cryogenic preservation mode. The amount of anger that is greeting this proposal jsut shows how anti-anything-new many people here are. At least hear the guy otu before proposing spending 100K on fighting the proposal!!!!

building a 40 story building or even a 20 story building on Headhouse square sounds like a terrible idea to most anyone who knows that area well. perhaps something more to scale with the area (like an Old City 108 design-type on arch street) would be met with a bit more support.

unfortunately, we have a situation in philadelphia that is creating some herculean conflicts across the city--a real estate boom. developers who own prime parcels of land in the city (eager to see a handsome ROI) are going to look at ways to get the biggest bang for their buck. and this means building UP. in this instance, a developer is never going to build a 4 story brick townhome with ground floor retail that is perfectly in scale with the surrounding neighbourhood. it's not going to happen. he is going to build UP, use the site's location as a prime selling point, and charge potential buyers a crapload of money for each unit...

that's the developers side. then we get the nimby's side who understandably feel that this building might be a bit out of place in this area of society hill. and the two battle it out. in the meantime, the rest of us are left with an ugly grassy /dirt parking lot that is an awful eyesore. these battles could last for years. if the nimby's win, we are stuck with that ugly lot indefinitely. if the developer wins, we may get a building (but then again we may not). but it all comes at a price of a lot of money spent on litigation and a lot of time looking at parking lots. everyone in philly wants the best building built at every location/lot in the city. but it's impossible to ever really know what that is.

I agree w/ CC and Londoner

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I think too often, though, we are saddled with the ugly empty/parking lots. Despite all the talk about a "real estate boom" and all the urban planners getting up in arms about how best to "manage the boom" so were aren't "left with a bunch of impersonal high rises that do not reflect the character of Philadelphia" (paraphrsing here but this is generally the argument made), we have so far seen only one - ONE - major residential high rise so far from the "real estate boom". That would be the St. James. No other residential high-rise (which I'll define as a building of over 15 floors) is even under construction at this stage. There are several that are planned but tied up in litigation foar various reasons and could very well likely not ever see the light of day. There's also the Symphony House which is supposed to start construction but hasn't yet.

So basically we are at a VERY embryonic stage of the boom and already the NIMBYs of this city are all up in arms about how we would be "mortgaging our future" by allowing "souless high rises" to be built.

I say these proposals need to get a fair hearing before they are discarded. The overreaction to the New Market proposal (with one guy going so far as to propose spending 100K of his own personal money to fight it) is really overreacting and premature. For all they know, they might like the project. However, they are not even giving the project a chance.

NYC, Chicago, and other cities are getting far mroe high-rises residential buildings than Philadelphia is or ever will get. The realtively tiny "boom" we are seeing, however, is arousing so much resistance and anger. Why? As I said, so far only ONE residential high rise has been built and no others are currently under construction. To hear these NIMBYs talk you'd think we have a building boom mroe out of control than Shanghai and that we are being suffocated by tall high rises!!!

Technically Waterfront Square is underway but it's location doesn't relate to your point with the nimby's.

Thats a great point CC, I think it was Inga Saffron who mentioned there are plans and blueprints for 2 dozen signifigant condo towers in center city, some are pie in the sky and will never see the light of day. But it really is tragic that only the St.James has been built to this point. And did anyone else see the Daily News article last week where J. Street was considering ending the property tax abatement on new housing in the city? That would bring the condo development to a screeching halt.


Globe St. mentioned a likely Fall 2005 groundbreaking for the condo at 20th + Market.

C'mon you guys - this is PHILADELPHIA!!!! We have plenty of neighborhood-destroying towers (Philadelphia definition or a tower: anything over 4 floors (incl. basement)) going up everywhere, and this city will be forever changed as a result. We must stop it NOW.

No boom you say? No boom??? Forget Chicago and New York - our boom rivals the likes of Wichita, Winnipeg even. New York and Chicago can't seriously be mentioned in the same breath. Consider the bloated 7-story Le Grenier being constructed at 11th & Spruce. And the 6 floors of the mighty National threaten to cast an insidious shadow across the far reaches of Old City - a neighborhood already darkened by that grotesque 65 foot shaft of concrete, glass and steel, York Square. And the vast proportions of Old City 108 simply defy description in earthbound human terms.

Look, you insane people, if you can't see that Philadelphia is being transformed into the Hong Kong of the Atlantic seaboard, you have all been blinded by the absurd phallic grandeur of these fascist monoliths. Wake up Philadelphia! We are in the midst of a hyperboom, a whirlwind transformation that will render our faire greene burg unrecognizable in a matter months and utterly obliterate our varied and venerable patchwork of weedy lots. WE MUST STOP THIS!

i feel that being a nimby is a terrible losing battle, the proverbial slippery slope. a nimby is willing to spend a ton of money fighting against a project. if they win, that means the developer got fed up, abandoned the project, and left town. then, another developer comes along, buys the parcel of land, sees that philly is in a "hot" real estate boom and creates plans for a new building--this time 20 stories taller than the last one. so, barely on the heels of celebrating their recent victory, the nimby's are back out on the front line spending money and wasting dozens of manhours to oppose this new project. after 3 years of hassle, the nimby's win again, and the developer backs out. another one comes along (as they always do), and sees that the height allowance on the property is 10 stories and decides to build a 9 story parking garage/monstrosity that will increase traffic/pollution/noise and decrease the neighborhoods likeability. the nimby's cant fight this one...and so after 9 years of legal wrangling, thousands of dollars spent, what do they get? an ugly parking garage instead of a condo/hotel tower.

the fact is that as philly's urban renewal continues, ALL of these lots in CC are going to be built on eventually, and the height of the buildings is really only determined by the state of the market. the hotter the market? the higher the building. these lots may not fill in for another decade, but at some point, a building WILL occupy these grasslots. anyways, it always seems that as a nimby, you are going to eventually lose. you fight one project and win, another one comes along. as we are seeing now, the nimby's that won their fights a few years ago are now facing the prospect of an even HIGHER buildings being built on the plots instead...

they fought 30 stories, and now, because the developer is old college buddies with someone on the zoning committee, they are going to get 52 stories...

oh well. hopefully the big holes on market and penn square are filled in with a nice new building before this real estate cycle slows to a screeching hault. i should also caveat this post by saying that i dont believe building anything that is ever proposed is right. i want the best to be built in this city.

How right you are - we get garages and cheaper building materials instead of decent tall buildings because of the endless costly litigation.

Symphony House is underway

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- On the lookout for black people and immigrants

I hope that never happens. It seems that there's all this hue and cry about the "boom" going overboard and how it'll destroy the feeling of this "greene countrie towne". The NIMBYs of Center City will never agree with Street on most issues but they probably will join in with Street on this one. If they get their way then Philadelphia will go from ONE tall residential building having been built in the last 20 years to NO tall residential buildings. Of coruse that is exactly what the Luddites of this town want...