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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 06-20-2006, 11:32 AM
D-Man D-Man is offline
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Here is a very cool photo essay of the old Reading viaduct/trestle, which include the Spring Garden Station. You can clearly see the deterioration that CC spoke of earlier.

http://phillyskyline.com/trestle/index1.htm
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 06-20-2006, 07:13 PM
ebyrnes ebyrnes is offline
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Default If you want to see some old stuff...

try www.phillytrolley.com (disclaimer: this is my sweetie's great work).

SEPTA - it could be so much better, but I'm grateful at least that I don't have to take a stinky bus.

e
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 06-27-2008, 11:12 AM
speedbuggin speedbuggin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Cheat View Post
The old maps are still scattered across the system.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Septa_r...l_rail#History

Allentown service was cut in 1979.

Quakertown and Bethlehem service was cut back to Lansdale in 1981.

Pottstown, Reading, and Pottsville service was cut back to Norristown in 1981.

Newtown service was cut back to Fox Chase in 1981, but temporarily reinstated in 1983.

West Chester service was cut back to Elwyn in 1986 due to track conditions.

Ivy Ridge service was cut back to Cynwyd due to the condition of the Manayunk viadict.
The cut that affects me the most was when they shut down the R6 Cynwyd line past Cynwyd Station. I work near Cynwyd and I frequent Manayunk/Roxborough after work. It would be SO much easier to take a 5min train up to Manayunk than to travel there via several busses, which takes a lot longer and essentially makes a big circle!

EDIT: I just finished reading about the R6 Cynwyd line in Wikipedia. Apparently the "concerns about the concrete arch viaduct"'s concrete shedding was found to be fixable with surface work and that the bridge was otherwise safe. The required bridge surface work and refurbishment was completed in 1999 -- nearly a full decade ago -- so WHY must the R6 line still remain closed past Cynwyd?? It is quite annoying. Perhaps reopening it will encourage more affluent Manayunk residents to check out some of the declining businesses around Cynwyd that haven't seen strong business in a few years.

I'm seeing a trend here. Many of the transit cuts occurred in the early 1980s, back when it was more affordable to drive than take the train. Nearly 30yrs later, gas prices are ridiculously high and therefore some people are relying on mass transit more often(myself included). Provided that there's continued funding along with increased ridership and demand, do you think there's a chance Septa might reopen some of those train lines again? It would really help some of the people in faraway suburban areas(Newtown, Allentown, etc) to get into the city a lot quicker without so much reliance on a car. It might also help to maintain business for popular "tourist towns"(such as Newtown) that might otherwise be too expensive for some city residents to drive to.

Last edited by speedbuggin : 06-27-2008 at 11:26 AM.
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 06-27-2008, 11:37 AM
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MarketStEl MarketStEl is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by speedbuggin View Post
I'm seeing a trend here. Many of the transit cuts occurred in the early 1980s, back when it was more affordable to drive than take the train. Nearly 30yrs later, gas prices are ridiculously high and therefore some people are relying on mass transit more often(myself included). Provided that there's continued funding along with increased ridership and demand, do you think there's a chance Septa might reopen some of those train lines again? It would really help some of the people in faraway suburban areas(Newtown, Allentown, etc) to get into the city a lot quicker without so much reliance on a car. It might also help to maintain business for popular "tourist towns"(such as Newtown) that might otherwise be too expensive for some city residents to drive to.
Can't answer your question about the R6 Ivy Ridge, but as for the others:

With the exception of the PRR West Chester Branch beyond Elwyn and the PRR Norristown Branch (abandoned beyond Ivy Ridge decades ago) beyond Cynwyd, all of the services SEPTA eliminated were worked by RDCs (Rail Diesel Cars -- what insiders would now call DMUs [Diesel Multiple Unit]). As the Center City commuter tunnel lacks the right kind of ventilation, diesel trains cannot operate in it on a regular basis (I believe that SEPTA's diesel switch engines have made occasional runs through it), and because of this, SEPTA's policy thus far has been not to even consider diesel service anywhere in the region. I think this is short-sighted now: if Long Island Rail Road riders can adjust to changing trains at Jamaica or Babylon to reach points further out on non-electrified branches, why couldn't SEPTA run DMUs from Reading and Phoenixville to Norristown, or Quakertown to Lansdale?

Or New Hope to Warminster, for that matter?

Newtown to Fox Chase is for the foreseeable future a dead letter, as the entire Newtown Branch beyond Fox Chase is in a state of disrepair, with the at-grade crossing with the West Trenton line removed completely. I recall reading here that FRA rules now prevent its being reinstalled if the branch is ever restored.
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 06-27-2008, 12:28 PM
speedbuggin speedbuggin is offline
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Originally Posted by sayprepositions View Post
I wonder with all the development north of Spring Garden around 11th-7th streets if they will add a station just before the trains go underground in their final descent into Market East. It sure would be convenient for me.
This has probably already been mentioned, so if it has please pardon me(I don't feel like reading through 3 pages to see if it's been aforementioned or not)...but at one time there WAS a Spring Garden subway stop at that approximate location. It was along the Broad-Ridge spur(part of the Orange line), in between the Fairmount and China Town stations. It was closed in 1991 due to "low ridership," presumably due to the increasing crime, drug dealing, and gang activity occurring at this station and in the nearby neighborhood. This area of Spring Garden was in a state of decline for a while but in the past few years it's been slowly improving.

If you ride along the Broad-Ridge spur, you can still see the remnants of the since sealed-up station. It is covered with tons of metallic colored graffiti. There is rather dim lighting.

This station was located at Ridge Ave & 12th Street. One of the subway entrances was located in front of what is now a Citizens Bank. You can still see what was once the entryway to the stairs leading down to the station. It now appears as a long rectangular block-like thing in front of the bank. The side of this "block" that once served as the entryway has been boarded up with wooden boards. If you have good eyesight, you can look through the cracks in these boards and see the stairs that lead down to the former station. There's TONS of garbage covering these stairs.

The other former entryway to the defunct station is across the street, but has been sealed and completely covered with concrete. At street level, there are no visible remnants of the station on that side of the road.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 06-27-2008, 12:39 PM
speedbuggin speedbuggin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarketStEl View Post
Can't answer your question about the R6 Ivy Ridge, but as for the others:

With the exception of the PRR West Chester Branch beyond Elwyn and the PRR Norristown Branch (abandoned beyond Ivy Ridge decades ago) beyond Cynwyd, all of the services SEPTA eliminated were worked by RDCs (Rail Diesel Cars -- what insiders would now call DMUs [Diesel Multiple Unit]). As the Center City commuter tunnel lacks the right kind of ventilation, diesel trains cannot operate in it on a regular basis (I believe that SEPTA's diesel switch engines have made occasional runs through it), and because of this, SEPTA's policy thus far has been not to even consider diesel service anywhere in the region. I think this is short-sighted now: if Long Island Rail Road riders can adjust to changing trains at Jamaica or Babylon to reach points further out on non-electrified branches, why couldn't SEPTA run DMUs from Reading and Phoenixville to Norristown, or Quakertown to Lansdale?

Or New Hope to Warminster, for that matter?
EXACTLY!! Or better yet, is there a way they can run an energy efficient train or trolley along these tracks? I heard rumors that they were thinking of running a light rail vehicle along the former R8 Newtown line.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarketStEl View Post
Newtown to Fox Chase is for the foreseeable future a dead letter, as the entire Newtown Branch beyond Fox Chase is in a state of disrepair, with the at-grade crossing with the West Trenton line removed completely. I recall reading here that FRA rules now prevent its being reinstalled if the branch is ever restored.
That really sucks, because it would be very convenient for the people that live around those areas. Currently, the only way Newtown residents can get to Center City is if they take the way-annoying Bus 130 to the Langhorne station and hop onto the R3 from there(or they could transfer from the Bus 130 to the Bus 14, take it to Frankford Terminal, then hop on the El to downtown). The 130 is my LEAST FAVORITE bus...it runs less than once an hour, takes way long because it winds through all kinds of industrial complexes, and it stops running after 6:30pm or so(at least as of 2005). I don't know why I'm so concerned with Newtown, since I do not live there and I haven't worked in that town since early 2005, but I guess I just feel sorry for the people that live there but cannot drive.
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