C'mon Chris, that's all you are going to post on this thread?

I'd thought you'd have something more to say.

no, dear sir. texas weiners has a location on 13th st near doc johnson's. the weiners you are thinking of are served further south on 13th st.

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"You down wit OPM?"
Fumo: "Yeah, you know me!"

Ah, in your old "hood."

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“Cities have the capability of providing something for everybody, only because, and only when, they are created by everybody.” - Jane Jacobs

I keep meaning to get back to this to clarify Professor Dave's jaundiced and immorally wrong view of my viewpoint on this subject. :roll:

But as a quick shot across the bow of all you abatement fans:

Have you ever stopped to think that the abatement craze is creating a whole constituency to block the shift of property taxes from improvement value to land value (a shift that I believe many of you favor, as I do).

Since the abatements are only on the improvements, such a shift would cut into the profits of the weasels receiving them.

You all may just shoot yourselves in the foot. BLAM.

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“Cities have the capability of providing something for everybody, only because, and only when, they are created by everybody.” - Jane Jacobs

I'd like to agree w/ Chrissayer on the shifting and losing support for land value tax----but I actually think that it gets us part of the way there, whilst I think we'll never get it legislated (Like Chirissayer, I'm a big fan---I tried in St. Louis in Phila for 20 years.....not that anyone should give a rat's xss what I pushed, but I did get pretty convinced that we'll not see it here)...

In the meantime....as someone noted above, the investment induced by the abatements increases all values---including land---around.

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SPM

I understand Pittsburgh tried some form of land value tax and then backed away from it after not many years. Anyone know the specifics of why it didn't work out there? I'm a former Pittsburgher myself, but I really haven't kept up with doings there since moving to Philly a quarter century ago.

All that said, I'm a big fan of a land value tax for all the obvious reasons. The concept has Philadelphia roots too, being that one of its earliest and best known proponents was Henry George, whose birthplace museum (and one of several Henry George schools) is right here in Center City.

http://www.geocities.com/henrygeorge...smainpage.html

http://www.henrygeorgeschool.org/links.htm

Partly answering my own question about Pittsburgh (and more info about LVT at this link):

http://www.answers.com/topic/land-value-tax

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Cheers,
Jayfar
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“I am indeed well aware of the history of Conventional (sic) Hall, both globally and locally, and can assure you that we are carefully exploring avenues for its future.” -- Penn President Amy Gutmann 5 days before demolition began.

1) We can't get any tax reform done under this administration. Never could. Never Will. Does that mean we should have nothing being done in this city over 8 years?

2) The people who are getting the tax abatements are not weasels. They have chosen to buy here and have in turn driven development. They are making this a better town for ALL of us in the process. As I've said before, I live in the only building in the Loft District that's not abated. I hold no grudge against anyone who owns something that is.

3) Can't you possibly admit that the tax abatements have driven new construction and conversion, adding thousands of new units a year where before we only had a handful? CC has added over 9,000 new residents since 2000. Many of whom you'd label weasels. Many of whom I'd welcome eagerly. Can't you see all of the development in fringe neighborhoods that never would have happened without these abatements? The filling in of the gaps in CC itself? I mean, c'mon, 9th & Arch has been vacant THIRTY years, and just now is going to be developed. This expansion and filling in of CC brings far more money to the economy than the abatements take away from it.

As a soon-to-be resident of the Philadelphia area, I'm trying to weigh the pros and cons of the 10-year abatement. On the one hand, it's great to not have to pay that money for 10 years. But what happens to property values when those 10-year abatements end? Will buyers be less willing to buy? Or will the success of the building boom and the new neighborhoods have increased property values so much, buyers will look past that hurdle?

I know no one has a crystal ball. But true to my nature, I'm trying to look at all potential outcomes, and I figure this group's collective knowledge might be interesting.

allentown has a land value tax, at least for a few years. not sure when they instituted it. also not sure there is any real reason to go calling people weasels. one of the biggest opponents of the land value tax are car dealers.

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"You down wit OPM?"
Fumo: "Yeah, you know me!"

The rpesent value of the abatement gets capitlaized into the price of the property immediately---and the impact on a future selling price will be base don how many years left---but basically the future buyer will factor into his or her value of the property that an extra $$$ annual payment, and will decrease the offering price accordingly---so the original abatement buyers don't get a big break forever------only the owners of property when the abatment is passed. In fact--the buyers now may find they overpaid up front if they thoguht they were going to pass along the value of the abatement when they sell.

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SPM