The Philly vs. Baltimore comparison thread

[sharkfood]

I know you guys tend to feel superior to Baltimore (and with good reason, for the most part), but I think the two cities have enough in common to make for a very interesting comparison.

Philly and Baltimore are both old, large, East Coast rowhouse cities, with large black populations, which are overshadowed to some extent by neighboring cities (New York and DC). Philadelphia, of course, has more than twice the population of Baltimore (and always has) and was always more dependent on manufacturing for its economic base. It also has a somewhat lower percentage of African Americans. Nevertheless, the comparison is interesting.

These are my impressions from three trips to Baltimore recently:

1. Despite its terrible reputation for crime, Baltimore has neighborhoods that appear to be largely untouched by the crime issue. While jogging through South Baltimore, I was astounded at the number of free-standing flower pots and park benches in front of many of the rowhouses, and an absolute lack of window bars and glass block basement windows. There were also garden hoses connected to faucets right in front of people's rowhomes. Correct me if I'm wrong, but these items wouldn't last two weeks in a comparable part of Philadelphia.

2. It goes without saying that the streets are virtually free of trash, even in not so nice neighborhoods.

3. Philadelphia is far more blighted than Baltimore. Yes, you can go to Sandtown-Winchester and find boarded up rowhouses and empty grass lots, but it feels much different from North Philadelphia. The grass is cut in the grassy lots; they are not overgrown with weeds. And the abandoned homes are neatly boarded up and look more rustic than threatening. I imagine that Baltimore probably looks about the way Philadelphia looked around 1980, before the serious decay set in for the next two decades. Of course, the comparison is even more stark when it comes to commercial buildings. By and large, the commercial/industrial buildings in Baltimore are occupied by thriving businesses and there is no endless parade of industrial hulks as one might see in Kensington.

4. The number of different housing projects scattered here and there around Center City and University City never ceases to amaze me. Philadelphia was never a socially progressive city. How exactly did we come to have this many projects? At least three of our close-in neighborhoods, Northern Liberties, Bella Vista and Queen Village are directly impacted by nearby housing projects. Except for one tastefully rebuilt project on the east side of downtown, I just can't think of any projects that impact Baltimore's close in neighborhoods like Butchers Hill, Canton and Federal Hill.

5. Baltimore, as befits a southern city with not a lot of ethnic diversity, is extremely conservative architecturally. Probably even more so than Boston. Something like the Ragflats or Old City 108, just wouldn't fly in Baltimore. In that sense, Philadelphia is more like New York.

6. Baltimore just doesn't have the richness of Philadelphia's history and urban fabric. Upon returning from Baltimore on I-95, it is striking just how huge the Center City skyline appears. Unless someone can correct me, Baltimore just doesn't have the depth we have in theaters, performing arts groups, music, museums, schools, etc. We are more like New York in our cultural and artistic traditions. Baltimore seems a little second-rate in this area, hard though it tries.

7. Yes, it has to be said. Downtown Baltimore is attractive in parts, but largely devoid of people on a weekend afternoon. Walnut St., Chestnut St., although nothing like New York, still feel alive and urban. Charles St. does not.

[lighterthief]

I dont know Baltimore very well but my impressions are this.

Baltimore did a great job with thier harbor and engaging the waterfront. Admittedly they had more to work with than Philly but still there is something to be learned here

2nd I recall Baltimore had an agressive program to sell off the many abandoned row houses that plagued the city I think this was in the 80s or early 90s where they sold off houses for a token$ to owner occupants who would renovate. I am not sure the full history of this program but it was inspiring as an idea. Philly would be well served to more aggresively tackle the abandoned building issue. It is entirely too complicated to obtain vacant property. I believe many of the abandoned buildings and land in the city would be reclaimed more quickly if the city made a larger effort to get them back in circualtion. Also the current system favors speculators over owner-occupants

[eberger]

I lived in the Baltimore area for about 5 years and I think it is a great city with a lot to offer for its size and real estate value. However, one can not easily partake in an urban lifestlye in downtown Baltimore. AFAIK, no one chooses to live in Baltimore and forgo car ownership the same way they do here and more commonly NYC. The transit and density to do so is just is not there. Hailing taxi cabs is uncommon, most people call ahead of time. Correct me if I am wrong, but they do not have car sharing programs. You can not easily get around on foot. The streets downtown are far too wide and traffic moves too fast to foster a pedestrian culture. Also, there is not a high-end retail coordidor (like our Walnut St. between Broad and Rittenhouse Square) so I'm sure an even higher percentage of shopping for nice items is done at suburban malls.

Of course, thats just a comparison of CC Phila to DT Balt, I'm sure the outlying neighborhoods share many similarities, but I have not spent enough time in either to comment objectively.

[lighterthief]

1980s homesteading

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpag...52C0A960948260

1999 demolitions

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpag...55C0A96F958260

some old nyt articles on Baltimore. The rowhouse issue is definitley common. neither article gives a solution but both are histories that seem appliciable to philly

[Marianne]

I don't think Philly had a neighborhood to compare with Roland Park.

[Swinefeld]

interesting thread. I've been to Baltimore about 50 times and have been to most if the city's neighborhoods, most recently the seldom seen Curtis Bay. People from Philly look at Baltimore the way New Yorkers look at Philly, the smaller, poorer relation just to the south. Baltimore has a lot going for it, but the poverty problem is just as bad as Philly, if not worse. It seems to be prevalent even in Baltimore's "up and coming" neighborhoods.

Sharkfood, I have to disagree with your assessment of Philly never being a socially progressive city. Philadelphia has always been a national leader in the quantity and quality of charitable institutions that serve the poor and destitute.

[random]

Maryland is a communist dictatorship.

Pennsylvania is a free state (relatively).

Baltimore is in Maryland.

What more do you need to know?

[eberger]

Originally Posted by Marianne

I don't think Philly had a neighborhood to compare with Roland Park.

Chestnut Hill

[Colin P. Varga]

I lived in Baltimore in the 60's and early 70's, and again in the 80's. I moved to Philly in the mid 80's. Philly and Baltimore have much in common and the differences aren't that great. The one big difference is Baltimore had that Hertz - we try harder – attitude, and Philly has the – yo, we’re Philly – attitude. One thing that made a difference in Baltimore was the 1904 fire that burned 80 sq. blocks of downtown Baltimore which included the financial district, the banks. Baltimore didn’t really recover until the 1970’s.

When I was young Baltimore always had something to prove, in fact I often had to prove where I lived because nobody knew where Baltimore was. In school we were taught about Baltimore and Maryland history: founding of the colony in 1634, religious tolerance, during the Revolution Philadelphia fell to the British so Congress moved to Baltimore (John Adams didn’t like Baltimore any better than Philly), 1814 British burn DC but Baltimore defends itself at Ft. McHenry and defeats the British Army at North Point, first railroad was from Baltimore to Ellicott City, first telegraph message from Baltimore to DC, and so on. It goes without saying Baltimore has had its low points: riots, corrupt politicians, school integration, a certain Randy Newman song, etc.

The recovery in Baltimore started in the 1970’s and one thing that helped was a 3-term mayor who had a vision and worked hard for the city. One of the best things that could have happened to Philly was to have Mayor Rendell serve one more time. In lieu of changing that law Philly should quit using its feet for target practice, recognize that corruption and racism are best friends and both are keeping this city from a better future.

[Colin P. Varga]

Originally Posted by Marianne

I don't think Philly had a neighborhood to compare with Roland Park.

The most affluent neighborhood in Baltimore is Homewood which would be more comparable to Gladwynne.