PhillyBlog - Philadelphia  

Go Back   PhillyBlog - Philadelphia > Where We Are > General Discussion
Blogs Map Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read
Google
 
Web www.phillyblog.com

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 11-24-2007, 11:30 PM
Tannhauser's Avatar
Tannhauser Tannhauser is offline
Cheesesteak GURU! Wiz with
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,789
Blog Entries: 4
Default AFRICAN PRISONS or Another Reason To Thank God You're American

by
MICHAEL WINES
THE NEW YORK TIMES
Published: November 6, 2005
LILONGWE, Malawi - Since Nov. 10, 1999, Lackson Sikayenera has been incarcerated in Maula Prison, a dozen iron-roofed barracks set on yellow dirt and hemmed by barbed wire just outside Malawi’s capital city.
At Muala Prison in Malawi, the prisoners sleep on the floor, so tightly packed they cannot turn except en masse. Some cells hold 160 prisoners.
Prisoners take in the sun after being let out of their cells in the morning.
He eats one meal of porridge daily. He spends 14 hours each day in a cell with 160 other men, packed on the concrete floor, unable even to move. The water is dirty; the toilets foul. Disease is rife.
But the worst part may be that in the case of Mr. Sikayenera, who is accused of killing his brother, the charges against him have not yet even reached a court. Almost certainly, they never will. For sometime after November 1999, justice officials lost his case file. His guards know where he is. But for all Malawi’s courts know, he does not exist.
"Why is it that my file is missing?" he asked, his voice a mix of rage and desperation. "Who took my file? Why do I suffer like this? Should I keep on staying in prison just because my file is not found? For how long should I stay in prison? For how long?"
(Excerpt, Full Story: http://www.phaseloop.com/foreignpris...-africa02.html)
__________________
The Lord is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? The Lord is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid? - Psalm 27:1
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 11-25-2007, 12:36 AM
random's Avatar
random random is offline
Cheesesteak GURU! Wiz with
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,445
Default

Since I'm not a prisoner, that doesn't really make me glad to be in America.

American prisons are too soft. If prison were really a place people didn't want to go, we might see a good bit less crime.
__________________


"It is my earnest hope - indeed the hope of all mankind - that from this solemn occasion a better world shall emerge out of the blood and carnage of the past, a world found upon faith and understanding, a world dedicated to the dignity of man and the fulfillment of his most cherished wish for freedom, tolerance and justice."

- General Douglas Macarthur
Supreme Allied Commander of South-West Pacific (1945)
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 11-25-2007, 12:52 AM
God Guy God Guy is offline
Pretzel Vendor
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 51
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by random View Post
Since I'm not a prisoner, that doesn't really make me glad to be in America.

American prisons are too soft. If prison were really a place people didn't want to go, we might see a good bit less crime.
i wish our prisons were like that. if more prisoners died or got beat up, i bet a lot less people would commit crimes.
Reply With Quote

Advertisement

   
     
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 11-25-2007, 06:13 AM
Tannhauser's Avatar
Tannhauser Tannhauser is offline
Cheesesteak GURU! Wiz with
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,789
Blog Entries: 4
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by God Guy View Post
i wish our prisons were like that. if more prisoners died or got beat up, i bet a lot less people would commit crimes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by random View Post
Since I'm not a prisoner, that doesn't really make me glad to be in America.

American prisons are too soft. If prison were really a place people didn't want to go, we might see a good bit less crime.
You may have missed this a little further down...
Two-thirds of Uganda’s 18,000 prison inmates have not been tried. The same is true of three-fourths of Mozambique’s prisoners, and four-fifths of Cameroon’s. Even in South Africa, Africa’s most advanced nation, inmates in Johannesburg Prison have waited seven years to see a judge.
__________________
The Lord is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? The Lord is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid? - Psalm 27:1
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 11-25-2007, 11:58 AM
random's Avatar
random random is offline
Cheesesteak GURU! Wiz with
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,445
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tannhauser View Post
You may have missed this a little further down...
Two-thirds of Uganda’s 18,000 prison inmates have not been tried. The same is true of three-fourths of Mozambique’s prisoners, and four-fifths of Cameroon’s. Even in South Africa, Africa’s most advanced nation, inmates in Johannesburg Prison have waited seven years to see a judge.
Yeah, I saw it. I was just going by the caption to your first post.

To switch gears -- African civil rights and due process. Not so good. I bet it deters crime though.
__________________


"It is my earnest hope - indeed the hope of all mankind - that from this solemn occasion a better world shall emerge out of the blood and carnage of the past, a world found upon faith and understanding, a world dedicated to the dignity of man and the fulfillment of his most cherished wish for freedom, tolerance and justice."

- General Douglas Macarthur
Supreme Allied Commander of South-West Pacific (1945)
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 11-25-2007, 12:12 PM
Tannhauser's Avatar
Tannhauser Tannhauser is offline
Cheesesteak GURU! Wiz with
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,789
Blog Entries: 4
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by random View Post
To switch gears -- African civil rights and due process. Not so good. I bet it deters crime though.
An interesting point, but I wonder if the same values that give so little thought to human rights and due process also contribute to the shockingly high rates of crime?
If you tend to view people outside of your own tribe as subhuman, deserving of nothing, I can't imagine caring if you have them stacked in a cell like firewood or stealing their relief supplies during a faimne.
__________________
The Lord is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? The Lord is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid? - Psalm 27:1
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 11-25-2007, 12:30 PM
johnnie's Avatar
johnnie johnnie is offline
Cheesesteak GURU! Wiz with
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Fairmount
Posts: 2,935
Default

What other country does not give a trial to some of it's "prisoners of war" or well whatever name the US wants to call them? Hmmmmm......

I do think US jails should be **** holes though. Why should they get 3 hot meals a day, cable etc.? I think we should require some hard labor but a little bit of rehabilitation and schooling as well.

Last edited by johnnie : 11-25-2007 at 12:34 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 11-25-2007, 12:31 PM
Michael Tree's Avatar
Michael Tree Michael Tree is offline
Water Ice Vendor
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 922
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tannhauser View Post
An interesting point, but I wonder if the same values that give so little thought to human rights and due process also contribute to the shockingly high rates of crime?
If you tend to view people outside of your own tribe as subhuman, deserving of nothing, I can't imagine caring if you have them stacked in a cell like firewood or stealing their relief supplies during a faimne.
Plus, a lot of the people in those prisons never committed actual crimes. They're in there because of their political opinions, or because they annoyed the wrong people.

If a legal system is perceived as corrupt and arbitrary, that doesn't engender compliance to the law. At best, avoidance.

I have to agree with Tanny. The rule of law is one thing that makes America great. Mind you, it's hardly unique to America, since Canada, Europe, and much of South America are the same, if not better.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 11-25-2007, 02:38 PM
Tannhauser's Avatar
Tannhauser Tannhauser is offline
Cheesesteak GURU! Wiz with
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,789
Blog Entries: 4
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Tree View Post
I have to agree with Tanny. The rule of law is one thing that makes America great. Mind you, it's hardly unique to America, since Canada, Europe, and much of South America are the same, if not better.
It's interesting, if you travel to a third world country, you realize quickly that Rule of Law is "the furniture in the room" here. You never notice it until it's gone.
__________________
The Lord is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? The Lord is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid? - Psalm 27:1
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 11-25-2007, 03:54 PM
Michael Tree's Avatar
Michael Tree Michael Tree is offline
Water Ice Vendor
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 922
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tannhauser View Post
It's interesting, if you travel to a third world country, you realize quickly that Rule of Law is "the furniture in the room" here. You never notice it until it's gone.
Indeed. It's like the fundemental assumption of safety that we have, which many in third world countries don't. And even if we are on a slippery slope regarding the rule of law, with the detentions without trial in guantanamo, the abuse in abu Ghraib, and the president's heavy use of signing statements, these problems appear more serious here because they're done against the background of the solid rule of law. In many countries, these would be relatively minor things, compared to the authoritarian abuses already common there.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:36 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.