Think about what you just wrote.

First, you compare waterboarding with burning a man with an iron or ripping his fingers off.

Then, you ask if I think it's okay for the police to grab a witness to a crime off the streets and waterboard him.

What's happened to you? You used to be fun to debate, now, it's like you've gone completely off the rails in some desperate attempt to prove me wrong about anything.

Think about that.

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The Lord is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? The Lord is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid? - Psalm 27:1

Nope. Too comfy.

I do get your point though.

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Hmm, but is that cause, effect or just a perversely symbiotic relationship that their society has evolved into?

Completely academic question. There's no way I would really advocate allowing the gov't to deny any citizen or lawful resident's rights. It can get just as bad as the criminals when left unchecked.

Given the choice between out of control crime or an out of control gov't that is somehow able to stop crime, I'd have to pick neither and one is just as bad as the other.

Seems South Africa has both.

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Just because the two things aren't the same doesn't mean they're not both torture.

Shooting someone isn't the same as slitting his throat, then mocking him while watching him slowly die, but both of them are murder.

/voice of reason.

So torture is a word that defines dis-similar actions.
Like "Sanction" meaning to encourage/allow and discourage/prohibit.
How reasonable.

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The Lord is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? The Lord is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid? - Psalm 27:1

Ever been to Alcatraz? That place is creepy!

I think a cell should be 5x4 with a concrete slab for a bed. You want more? Too f-ing bad!

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Eat your heart out Mr. Obama.

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what is for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote" Benjamin Franklin

Yes there is a place where you wont be treated like a child.

I've thought about that, and what I'm thinking now is...

Waterboarding is not torture?

I mean... it seems a lot more disturbing than being in a darkened room with the КГБ agents, chained to a chair with a bare lightbulb dangling over your head. Back in the day (the 80s), we thought that was horrible.

What are we doing?

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WHYY pays their CEO $750,000 a year. So WHYY should I renew my membership? Seems they have no problems finding money and spending it unwisely.


And this is why you should donate to PACCA, not PETA:

In September, PETA made headlines in Vermont and across the nation for asking Ben & Jerry's ice cream to use human breast milk in their ice cream, instead of cow milk

Alcatraz is too comfy.

They get seaside vistas out their windows. Do you know how much it costs to buy a place on the East Bay to have sweeping views of San Francisco?

And just minutes from downtown, Alcatraz is. Too comfy!

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WHYY pays their CEO $750,000 a year. So WHYY should I renew my membership? Seems they have no problems finding money and spending it unwisely.


And this is why you should donate to PACCA, not PETA:

In September, PETA made headlines in Vermont and across the nation for asking Ben & Jerry's ice cream to use human breast milk in their ice cream, instead of cow milk

Right. Waterboarding is NOT torture. Is it coercive? Yes. Does it cause intense pain, and long term injury/disfigurement? No.

And we're not dealing with civilized individuals who at least share the most basic common values.
We're dealing with people fanatically dedicated to not just defeat of our military and submission of our government, but to total destruction of our civilization through murder of innocent civilians ignoring all accepted rules of warfare.
If Khalid Sheik Mohammed gets water poured over his face for lying to our interrogators about a plot that's in the works, that's a whole universe away from Stazi kicking down random citizen's doors and dragging them away to a prison camp.

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The Lord is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? The Lord is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid? - Psalm 27:1

You'd provide a bed, huh?



I'd like to see that the weights and gym equipment be removed. Bigger, badder criminals aren't much of a bonus when they get out. Basketball and other recreation to keep the riots to a minimum are OK.

I'd like to see some form of forced labor. Train people to get up and go to work every day. The hard way if that's what it takes.

Not sure what else. That would be a start.

Never been to Alcatraz. From what I've seen about it on TV, criminals did not like it there and didn't want to return. Is it more creepy than North Philly? How about North Philly late at night?

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