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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 11-03-2007, 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by frankdialogue View Post
Does this posting indicate Mr.Tannhauser is getting concerned about the government/educational/corporate complex's desire to take away our liberties and reprogram us?
Does this mean that Mr. Dialogue is begining to gain an understanding of the difference between Public and Private ownership? It doesn't appear so.
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Originally Posted by QVNewcomer View Post
Knowledge does tend to have a liberal bias.
Actually, Knowledge has a Conservative bias, intelligence is required to be a liberal. It's necessary to preform the mental gymnastics to arrive at such contradictory conclusions.
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Originally Posted by phillyaggie View Post
While I agree with the notion of more education = more liberal outlook, how does one account for decidedly conservative campuses such as Univ of Chicago, and Texas A&M University?
I wouldn't call U of Chicago conservative. Agreed they have a few tenured Economics professors who aren't avowed marxists, but the overall make up of staff and students leave it a far cry from VMI, The Citadel, Liberty, The Service Academies, or Grove City.
As far as Texas A&M goes, it's a Senior Military College and just doesn't have an appeal to folks with a liberal bent, just like the aforementioned schools with Conservative schools. On the other hand, if you're looking for a school that espouses Conservative values, you've only got about ten or so to choose from, and those are pretty well stocked with Cs.
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Last edited by Tannhauser : 11-03-2007 at 11:22 AM.
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old 11-03-2007, 11:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tannhauser View Post
Does this mean that Mr. Dialogue is begining to gain an understanding of the difference between Public and Private ownership? It doesn't appear so.

Actually, Knowledge has a Conservative bias, intelligence is required to be a liberal. It's necessary to preform the mental gymnastics to arrive at such contradictory conclusions.

I wouldn't call U of Chicago conservative. Agreed they have a few tenured Economics professors who aren't avowed marxists, but the overall make up of staff and students leave it a far cry from VMI, The Citadel, Liberty, The Service Academies, or Grove City.
As far as Texas A&M goes, it's a Senior Military College and just doesn't have an appeal to "hate America" liberal types, just like the aforementioned schools with Conservative schools.
Tanny, two things.

First, most business faculty at colleges and universities tend to be more conservative than not.

Second, UDel, has changed this already, and I have been privy to communications of some faculty at a local large university, business faculty, that thought this was an ill-conceived plan.

Temper your ire, now, please. Not all universities are flaming bastions of liberal ideologies.
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Old 11-03-2007, 11:27 AM
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Yeah, I read some of those materials on U Del's website, and I was quite thoroughly appalled. And I consider myself to be well left of center. I've heard that even the liberal civil rights groups aren't happy about this disturbing brainwashing program.
The interesting thing about FIRE, is they don't really display an ideological bias one way or the other. In fact, if you look at the founders and senior staff, you see a lot of ACLU work, left blogging, and a history of defending left wing causes.
This group sure isn't The Heritage Foundation.
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  #14 (permalink)  
Old 11-03-2007, 11:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Hospitalitygirl View Post
Tanny, two things.

First, most business faculty at colleges and universities tend to be more conservative than not.

Second, UDel, has changed this already, and I have been privy to communications of some faculty at a local large university, business faculty, that thought this was an ill-conceived plan.

Temper your ire, now, please. Not all universities are flaming bastions of liberal ideologies.
Actually, there was a study sited in the Chronicle of Higher Education last month that said Business Professors voted for Kerry over Bush in 2004 by a margin of 2-1.
Take that for what it's worth, but it doesn't show much a trend towards Conservativism.
Of course UD has scuttled the plan, but my ire is far more directed at the idea that someone thought they could use tax payer funds for ideological/political purposes.
If, say, Bob Jones University had a similar program that avowed some "Conservative" ideas, I'd have a huge problem with that because it's publicly funded (through Federal and State loans and Grants), OTOH, if Grove City wanted to do that, I'd have no problem whatsoever becuase it's all privately funded.
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Old 11-03-2007, 11:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Tannhauser View Post
Actually, there was a study sited in the Chronicle of Higher Education last month that said Business Professors voted for Kerry over Bush in 2004 by a margin of 2-1.
Take that for what it's worth, but it doesn't show much a trend towards Conservativism.
Maybe those business professors understood something about the flaming, expensive, disgrace of an administration that is Bush's. #2, not #1. I actually liked #1.
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Old 11-03-2007, 11:55 AM
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so uneducated=conservative and educated=liberal? who needs education when such intelligent, insightful things exist for free on the internets. Perhaps what the thread does best is confirm that liberals are every bit as self righteous as the conservatives they despise.
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Old 11-03-2007, 12:00 PM
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Maybe those business professors understood something about the flaming, expensive, disgrace of an administration that is Bush's. #2, not #1. I actually liked #1.
Assuming a business professor's area of knowledge or expertice would be business, I would doubt that.
A GDP growth rate of @4%
50 straight months of job growth
4.7% unemployment rate
2.7% inflation
Low interest rates

You could rationally disagree with a lot of Bush's policies (I do), but the economy/business isn't one of them.
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 11-03-2007, 02:24 PM
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It's interesting that the University of Delaware is back-pedalling &
trying to deny some of the more odious parts of their planned brain-washing program...but why or who tried to institute this program in the first place?...anyway, for those of you want to get into this topic a bit more, here is a great piece of 'futurist-fiction' written by
Steven Yates:
http://www.lewrockwell.com/yates/yates76.html

It is about a 20 page work, so if you have a printer, print it out and sit back and take it in...it closely ties in with the thinking behind the University of Delaware brainwashing program...Yate's story really is a classic.

Last edited by frankdialogue : 11-03-2007 at 02:26 PM.
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Old 11-03-2007, 03:30 PM
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Tanny, A&M is one of only six SMCs, sure. But its uniformed Corps is only about 2000 kids on a campus of more than 45,000. I know, because I attended that university for my undergrad degree. The situation? A&M attracts more of its students from small-town Texas and from the white/conservative rich suburbs of Houston and Dallas. But, as the university has expanded over the last decade into being one of the 5 largest in America (student-population wise), it has become a little more liberal...not that anyone would mistake it for Liberal U or anything.

Oh, and I'm actually more liberal than I am conservative.

My point is that more diversity on campuses and a zeal to question ideas and norms usually leads to one becoming more liberal.

According to your survey, even business faculty voted 2 to 1 for Kerry. You'd think business and entrepreneurship-minded people would be more conservative. Or perhaps, this shows that Republican doesn't always equate to conservative, nor does Democrat equate to always being liberal.
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Old 11-03-2007, 07:32 PM
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I only heard about this story but I've been reading up on it quite a lot because I'm originally from Wilmington and graduated from UD in '99.

I agree - this program definitely went too far. Some of the stories are appalling, even to a moderate liberal like me.

That being said - I don't think it's fair to characterize how UD is reacting as purely "backpedaling". I don't get the impression that UD set out to do Marxist-style reeducation. They had decent intentions, but completely mismanaged the program. For example, one could choose to believe one of two things regarding the "rating" of students:

1) UD told its RA's to rate their students. When FIRE exposed the program, UD's president baldfacedly lied to the press when he said some RA's merely misunderstood the instructions.

2) UD did NOT ask RA's to "rate" their students, but through typical bureacratic foulup failed to give RA's good direction. Left to their own devices, some RA's chose to "rate" their students and do some of the other, more outrageous activities.

Occam's Razor, as well as my personal experience, leads me to believe #2. I think some conservative pundits choose to pounce on #1 because it sounds juicier, but the simpler answer is usually the right one.

Also, based on my experiences there, UD is not a monolithic bastion of liberalism. In fact, several Christian groups and College Republicans were quite active (I myself was good friends with two Intervarsity Christian activists, which made for some quite lively discussions). Also, I would consider the administration to be, if anything, a little bit conservative.

I find nothing inherently wrong with Student Life holding (optional, not mandatory) programs that encourage students to discuss race, ethnicity, etc. - but it's very tricky to do properly. Learning about issues like racism, discrimination, etc. is just as integral to a well-rounded college experience as is learning calculus or art history.

Lastly, I would like to point out that UD football is #1 in the CAA and #9 in the national I-AA rankings. Go Blue Hens!
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