You admit you don't know the details of any of these deals....yet you declare them illegal and fraudulent. You don't know that the $35k BMW comes with a $425k condo. You don't know whether the lenders are aware of this offer. As I pointed out, the ad is quite vague. I've seen ads for "free cars" with home purchase...but if you look at the details it is often a 2yr lease valued at maybe $8,000. You don't have all the details on this offer, nor do I yet you expect me to declare it illegal? I don't comment on things I don't know about. If you have the agreements of sale and settlement sheets in hand for these "questionable" deals I would be happy to review them. Otherwise, neither you nor anyone else can deem them to be illegal.

I have no reason to defend other realtors nor do I have any reason to attack them without all....or ANY... of the details. Do you want me to say I abhor people who commit fraud and other crimes. OK. I don't like criminals. Happy? Of course, until you show me actual evidence of a crime or fraud all we are operating on is your assumptions.

Were artificially inflated appraisals done? I'm sure. Were banks and agents complicit in these? I'm sure. Does this apply to most, all or many transactions? Not as far as I can tell. To my knowledge every deal I have been involved in was legit.

Oh. Sorry!

Anyway, have a nice weekend everyone.

Or quite simply "put up or shut up." On a more personal note, I like my realtor and am happy with the work she does.

We tried to buy in east falls when we got here since my wife could then walk to med school and I work from home.

Places were gone in 4 days.

In the end, wea re glad we didn't. We met a whole bunch of cool people in Fairmount

__________________
Peace Out, Philly!

Even in the Hamptons, Homes Are Slow to Sell

By VALERIE COTSALAS Published: May 18, 2008


http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/18/ny...in&oref=slogin

There are a huge number of cases of "evidence of a crime or fraud" (your quotes) check here, here, here, and here . Many, many other articles like the above are available online. The FBI says that this type of crime grew dramatically during the run-up and that most cases have not been investigated.

You've now admitted that agents were complicit in fraud, but you aren't sure as to the extent of it. That's a first step and perhaps the above citations will help take you to the next step.

A $35k car given away on a $450k mortgaged condo where that information is not provided to the lender is something that you should be able to say is illegal; as I said before, forget the Bella - that you will not say that this described deal (described, as in the last sentence) is illegal is bizarre.

What people will come to understand is that the army of 1.2MM realtors (and the appraisers directed by the agents) defrauded the country out of hundreds of billions, if not trillions of dollars. Why is the government now buying hundreds of billions of bad MBS and CDO debt? Because of the incomparable deflation in housing. And what caused the deflation? The prior inflation which was as a result of appraisal fraud and "rah-rah" scams. Why exactly is it so difficult to get an agent to admit this fact? This is the "new paradigm" in real estate sales - it's called "truth".

Also presumably you know that the the Bella BMW deal is not a lease - here's a fact: it's not a lease.

Example from one article above: "Within weeks, he was chest-deep in dozens of investigations of suspected mortgage fraud, and was helping federal investigators get the goods on real estate scammers who commit what are known as inflated-sale and-crash schemes, Lackner said. The term refers to a scam in which a buyer ---- with the help of dishonest real estate agents and appraisers ---- purchases a home for more than market price, receives cash at the closing of escrow and then lets the property fall into foreclosure."

The government has already purchased a substantial amount of MBS and CDO bad debt and may be obligated to purchase a lot more. If it doesn't the government may feel that many financial institutions critical to the US infrastructure will not survive. This is the consequence.

Taxpayers and savers will pay for appraisal fraud and fraud committed with the full knowledge of realtors who participated in these schemes; that there was no clear guidance by the NAR on "cash back" is a disgrace and the fact that even now most realtors will not admit that it is a singularly bad idea to offer these incentives at closing is just unbelievable.

Wow, it's been a while since I've looked at this thread and the dialogue looks exactly the same! LOL While you've all been arguing about how bad Philly's market is, I sold an investment property of mine in Grad Hospital and got my asking price in less than 48 hours. I was expecting it to take at least 2 to 3 months, but I put nice finishes inside and the layout is spacious and I priced it right while still walking away with six figure profits AFTER transfer, gains taxes and broker fees. Can't you tell how "sick" I am about this? Hee-Hee!!! Have fun kids!!!

Beware of Auction Charades

May 06, 2008

Doug French, an executive vice president of a Nevada bank, spent Derby day at a housing auction in Las Vegas and what he saw wasn't pretty -

"Finally it was post time for the action and the first home went up for bid – just short of 2,600 square feet in southwest Las Vegas. A brand new home, a one-year builder warranty, built by a reputable builder with a nearly 99 percent customer satisfaction rating, the auctioneer emphasized. To listen to the auctioneer, the bidding quickly escalated from the $159,000 starting point. The three young men working the crowd were frantically giving signals to the auctioneer, quickly moving from one attendee to another, and the price of home kept rising. It seemed like a real auction. But it was only real like professional wrestling is real. There were no actual bids on the first house, or the second, or the third. No bidding cards were raised.

The auction company kept up the charade for over 2 hours and for all 46 homes. The auctioneer’s rapid-fire delivery never waned. The young ladies who were there to help winning bidders with their sales contracts stood in the corner and clapped in unison until the very end. And the young tuxedoed gentlemen who worked the floor carried on with their elaborate gestures and signaling, as if it was a choreographed Broadway dance routine.

Only a couple dozen people remained by auction end, and only a handful of homes were actually sold. There were few real bids even at the low starting prices that were only a third the price that similar homes fetched during the boom a couple years ago."

http://www.lewrockwell.com/french/french88.html

http://dealbreaker.com/2008/05/06/