Has gentrification reached Kensington yet in any ways? - Page 3 - PhillyBlog

moritz391 · #21 (**permalink**) 05-23-2007, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daveydoo

Origionally posted by Malloy:
Luxury loft?.....F that. I want to buy raw, or non lux space, a few stories up in a pre war building with indoor parking. I'd even move to Kenso if I could find it...

I have wondered as well why developers have not marketed raw space. I would speculate (no pun intended) that by the time they take care of the envelope (new roof, windows, tuckpointing, etc.) and the systems (main service for plumbing, heating, electric) they discover that financially speaking they wouldn't get enough for them after going through that aggravation (as well as permits, etc.). They figure they can put in all the bells & whistles and get alot more for them.

Most 'luxury lofts' aren't. But you are right in terms of developers wanting the signifant returns for adding some basic finishes. A big part of this, though, is financing. Most buyers (especially low-end buyers) will have trouble getting financing for at raw unit, as it's a risky mortgage for banks because the constructuion process entails risk (my first raw loft when down tropical storm when a crappy contractor left it exposed in July and had to be rebuilt almost entirely when it was only a week from move-in).

Raw lofts typically make sense on the other end of the market--like the Liponcott (sp) building on Washing Square. There, buyers were willing to pay substantial premiums for the location, but also were wanting to have their own architects design their space. Many spent $300-500k on 2BR's just for finishes.

I absolutely agree, though, that 'affordable' lofts are a great idea and something missing from the market place. There are some projects in the mix, just not any with Mike McCann signs on them.

Malloy · #22 (**permalink**) 05-23-2007, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moritz391

There are some projects in the mix, just not any with Mike McCann signs on them.

Where? I would buy one in an instant if I cound find something cheap. Id even buy something in Kenso if its surrounded by other old industrial buildings....

moritz391 · #23 (**permalink**) 05-23-2007, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malloy

Where? I would buy one in an instant if I cound find something cheap. Id even buy something in Kenso if its surrounded by other old industrial buildings....

What range are you thinking? There's more activity these days around Cecil B Moore up to 5th. If want to PM me, I can let you know what I have. I may also be getting my fingers into this sort of product--raw space with a very high-quality 'machine core' (meaning kitchen, bath, and mechanicals) brought in as a module. It's a good 8-12 month off, but I could give you a heads up when it comes up.

merkin · #24 (**permalink**) 05-23-2007, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malloy

Where are these available warehouses?? I've seen a few (2 are apt buildings)...but the only ones that seem ' available ' are 1 story cinderblock crap. Ive seen quite a few in Port Richmond, but it seems like many of those were sold to speculators these last 5 years. Meaning, no cheap opportunities.

thats because most sold 2-3 years ago. my friend ownes the buildings on cecil b abd mascher to the north. he was offered 2.5M for them last year. he declined the offer. where are you going to move? he makes for money long term on rent there. they bought it 15 years ago for 15K. when does a neighborhood gentrify. when the hipsters move in or when the big developers buy up property. most of teh neighborhood was bought around the time that the crane building was bought. now people are planning and waiting. we moved for this reason. it is way to expensive. hey malloy, there is a 6,200 2ft warehouse for sale in brewerytown. i have talkied him down to 70K. want to be neighbors. you can park your pretty red car inside your house!!!!!

merkin · #25 (**permalink**) 05-23-2007, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Tanks

I have to say. Its kind of amazing. I own a general contracting biz. I was looking for a large building I could live and work in. I bought a 7200 sq/ft warehouse for 45k about 3 years ago. Granted it needed a lot of work, but at the time people thought I was freaking INSANE for buying something close to Frankford and Alleghenny.

2 Peices of advice. There are PLENTY of incredible deals to get around here, if you can deal with putting in time, effort and elbow grease. And your willing to live through people telling you your insane for being a pioneer. I've always thought it was crazy that someone would buy a rinky dink 1br condo in center city for 400k and then spend another 30k on a parking spot! when they could spend the same amount and buy an acre worth of houses here in the ghetto and create their own feifdom. I mean, its truly insane. But we are very much a "I want it now" society. I met a guy that bought an absolutely HUGE warehouse. Like 50,000 sq/ft building shaped like a giant square donut with a courtyard in the middle for 60k about 5 years ago. But its right off of kensington ave. Have some vision, be willing to go out and do good in your hood and the sky is the limit.

Get a grip on the ghetto mentality. Drive the areas you think you might want to live in. People around here don't trust the man! Therefore, they don't want to list with a realtor. 9 times out of 10 they don't want you using a title company either. Drive around, look for for sale my owner signs. I can tell you of at least 3 properties right off the bat that are way over 3000 sq/ft and you can purchase under 50k.

curious, how did you finance your building? we are looking at place here in brewerytown that is way to cheap to not act on. and you are right about owning a block. if it is cheap enough and you are the first one and have big bank, you can make a world of difference. i have a friend who did just that. he bought every single vacant building on a small street around broad and girard.he bought half the block, i think 9 properties. he changed that block completely by renovating them.

Strange Tanks · #26 (**permalink**) 05-23-2007, 04:48 PM

Hmm...yeah. I should have mentioned that financing thing. I've been here for a number of years now. Still havnt found a bank willing to lend me money. Everything so far has had to be cash. The problem isnt actually the bank. Its the appraisal. I've actually had appraiser drive by and never even bother to stop. They just say, thats not a house I won't do it.

merkin · #27 (**permalink**) 05-23-2007, 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Tanks

Hmm...yeah. I should have mentioned that financing thing. I've been here for a number of years now. Still havnt found a bank willing to lend me money. Everything so far has had to be cash. The problem isnt actually the bank. Its the appraisal. I've actually had appraiser drive by and never even bother to stop. They just say, thats not a house I won't do it.

we had a similar problem and ended up buying through the owner. we are now in the process of refinancing. our buildings are c-2 mixed use and we live here, they seem to be more willing with a property like this to finacne, we will see. we are thinking of taking out equity to buy another warehouse building on our block before things get way out of our range. there would be no other way to buy it. getting a commercial loan is very difficult. we prefer the 15 year mortgage, you save mad cash over the term.

moritz391 · #28 (**permalink**) 05-23-2007, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Tanks

Hmm...yeah. I should have mentioned that financing thing. I've been here for a number of years now. Still havnt found a bank willing to lend me money. Everything so far has had to be cash. The problem isnt actually the bank. Its the appraisal. I've actually had appraiser drive by and never even bother to stop. They just say, thats not a house I won't do it.

My first place was a gem of an over-build, under-loved building in South Philly. I ran into the same issue. I ended up convincing my parents to take out an equity line on their house which I would then pay as a sort of private mortgage. It was a massive leap of faith that paid very nice dividends.

I ended up refinancing to pay them off, but the interest was 10% for a 75% LTV with a really crappy appraisal. The place was cheap enough that I could afford to throw some cash and a lot of sweat into fixing it up and the place actually more than trippled in value in 1 year, netting me almost double my original price. I wish I would have been able to keep it, but I got something of a bug and eventually went into development full-time (I was trained as an architect).

The trick is just to not ever give up with financing. If you have credit and a job, someone will give you the money. But don't expect to pay 6% and don't expect it to be simple. There are commercial people all over the place, it's just pricey. But as far as I was concerned, I got 4000 sq ft for about the price of a shitty studio in BV at the time, and for about the same money as the 800 sq ft houses on the block. I didn't have a shower for a year, but I did have powder rooms (from the 1st floor office use), a mini fridge, a microwave, and a gym pass. So while I wasn't living in luxury, at least I was really buff (gym=shower).

Just do it. And don't look back.

portfishsington · #29 (**permalink**) 06-05-2007, 09:55 PM

It looks like the bad part of kensington are invested heavily by individuals and companies from out of towns and states.

Check out links below a company in New York bought 9 properties next to K&A. Are they trying to change the whole block or what?

http://brtweb.phila.gov/brt.apps/Sea...spx?url=search

2522986001859 E WISHART ST
ROW 2 STY MASONRYCITY ONE PROPERTIES II LL $87,136 04/27/2007
2522966001819 E WISHART ST
ROW 2 STY MASONRYCITY ONE PROPERTIES II LL $87,136 04/27/2007
2522964001815 E WISHART ST
ROW 2 STY MASONRYCITY ONE PROPERTIES II LL $87,1360 4/27/2007
2522961001809 E WISHART ST
ROW 2 STY MASONRYCITY ONE PROPERTIES II LL $87,1360 4/27/2007
2522987001861 E WISHART ST
ROW 2 STY MASONRYCITY ONE PROPERTIES II, L $36,0000 4/16/2007

2522712001858 E LIPPINCOTT ST
ROW 2 STY MASONRYCITY ONE PROPERTIES III L $98,0000 4/27/2007
2522802001863 E LIPPINCOTT ST
ROW 2 STY MASONRYCITY ONE PROPERTIES III L $98,0000 4/27/2007
2522794001847 E LIPPINCOTT ST
ROW 2 STY MASONRYCITY ONE PROPERTIES III L $98,0000 4/27/2007
2522782001823 E LIPPINCOTT ST
ROW 2 STY MASONRYCITY ONE PROPERTIES III L $98,0000 4/27/2007

Brian S · #30 (**permalink**) 06-06-2007, 10:18 PM

I was driving around just west of aramingo and ann st and noticed that a lot of boarded up houses have disappeared. (By disappeared I mean the no more plywood on the windows) Has anyone else noticed a decline in boarded up properties in kensington?