Everytime I read a post like this or hear about this happening from someone it makes me ill. The suburbs are a rampant disease that needs to be stopped. Send your kids to catholic or private school (its not that expensive), raise them in the neighborhood, guide them and stay involved in their lives and they will grow up much stronger and more competitive individuals than kids raised in the 'burbs. Anyone else feel the same way I do about this? Every time that I have to go to the suburbs for something (very rare) it makes me sick just looking around at the total lack of friendship among neighbors, the cookie cutter appearance of everything, and the complete lack of sidewalks and no ability to walk anywhere. I could go on and on about the poison that the suburbs secrete, but I'll save your eyes the trouble. Again stay in the neighborhood, be involved with your kids, and they and you will be just fine.

I moved to the suburbs once in between cities. It was the most terrible living experience of my life, and I will never ever ever exist in that suburban nightmare again. It's no way to live.

The original poster was looking for feedback and someone gave an opinion. Nothing to get ill over.

I wasn't replying to the OP. In fact I wasn't replying to anyone. I was commenting on the situation presented in the post that I "quoted" in my previous post. And I continue to stand on the fact that suburbs represent all that is evil and wrong. In fact, my response could possibly have a positive effect on the original poster's formation of a decision. Especially since they are coming from Williamsburg, Brooklyn which is a neighborhood I'm quite familiar with. They probably agree with me on my comments about suburban traits and (lack of) culture.

Actually, we're open to the possibility of living outside the city - while I don't like strip mall culture, there are suburbs, and then there are suburbs. The ones that adhere to typical suburban zoning laws tend to get what they deserve - monoculture - but there are places outside cities where you can walk, run into people etc. And suburbs get built because people want to live in them. Some people, anyway.

That said, some of the things we in particular want to do - like participate in an arts community - are tougher to do when you have to drive into town to be a part of it. So we're trying to find the right balance.

Having a kid has sort of changed my perspective on things, and basically these days I don't begrudge anyone's personal lifestyle decisions, especially when it comes to family.

America decided 60 years ago that this is how we prefer to live... in nameless, faceless suburbs. And you'll eventually be buried in some no-name cemetery that will eventually go uncared for if the underlying economic conditions in the surrounding community fail.

Ok, as bitter as that sounds, I won't begrudge suburbanites either. However, suburbanites are just as jealous of city folks underneath all that "I don't have to put up with crime/bad schools" when they sit stuck in traffic for hours on end--a problem suburbanites have dealt with since suburbia came along. Even when the jobs ARE located in suburbs, that doesn't stop inter-burban traffic and actually makes it worse with city-sized traffic trying to move through local roads.

And count me wrong, but I think Philadelphia is the place that came up with the concept of the suburb to begin with... mini towns that cling economically onto a larger adjacent city to begin with and rely heavily on connecting transportation links (the main line being the first of them). However, the Main Line fed off train links with the city long before the road links became more important.

Then when Levitt & Sons put up the Levittowns in NYC and Phila, that started the whole idear of putting up mass construction cookie cutter homes without basements everywhere.

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And this is why you should donate to PACCA, not PETA:

In September, PETA made headlines in Vermont and across the nation for asking Ben & Jerry's ice cream to use human breast milk in their ice cream, instead of cow milk

I know several families in Fishtown raising their very well-behaved children here. There are issues no matter where you raise your children--I'm watching my suburban cousins go through drug use, dropping out, etc. of nice, suburban schools.

I don't think it's easy to raise kids anywhere. But I've often heard Williamsburg compared to Fishtown. I think there are many more kids in Fishtown than No. Libs--it's more of an established family community with a much larger housing stock. That could be some of the different, 3rd&Brown.

If I have kids though here, there's no question they'd go to a private school.

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Resident of Fishtown, Moderator of Fish/No. Libs/Kenzo forum, Real Estate Agent-Prudential Fox & Roach

So I was raised in Fishtown and moved to the 'burbs. Mostly it was a move because I myself became tired of the city and the neighborhood and everyone knowing everyone's business. As a female, I sometimes hated, hated walking home on Girard after a day of work and having to deal with some of the sketchier people. Some people, however, love this stuff. My relatives there thrive on the fact that they have "scoops" on things going on with so-and-so and what house is being sold or buiilt for what amount of money and know everyone. Me, I hated that I couldn't even go into my house without someone peeking out the window at me just to see who I was or what I was doing or who was my friend.

Back in the area, I saw an "artist" family move in and have a daughter. I was close with the mom and she said how she was moving with other neighbors in NL area to try and get a charter school going and that the school options were limited. She didn't want Catholic school for religious reasons.

However, growing up, that's what you did. The public schools were considered not great at all and so many parents did the sacrifice and sent the kids to the Catholic schools in the area - Holy Name, St. Laurentius, St. Michael's, but now all but one are closed I think. It helped to get a more stable education for the kids and most continued right on to Catholic high school.

I have to say that my 'burb life is different and maybe it's my special lot of neighbors or townhome setup, but we have summer joint bbq's, join up for beers occassionally, always say hi to each other and take a few minutes to chat in the parking area and a walk around the development still gets you "hi's" from others taking the same strolls. I guess we'll see how the schools go, but I probably will go with the Catholic school, so my perspective might differ.

As for the drugs and whatnot, I had plenty of friends with no curfews, drug doers, parents were alcoholics and as people got older, the good seeds and bad seeds were distinguished. Both still reside in the area with their families and the good probably have the same worries. Hopefully the good outdoes the bad, but you never know around there. I know all too many "good" that have moved on to areas like the NE and Chestnut Hill.

I grew up in the suburbs, in a close community with a small elementary school we walked to daily. I knew all my neighbors and could walk to small stores in the town. The suburbs aren't a disease. Ugh.

That doesn't sound like the typical post WWII American suburb. It sounds like you grew up in either an older suburban town or a really well planned more modern development, both of which there a few very good examples locally. These definitely are not diseases, but from a city dweller's POV these are the exception not the rule.

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Have you ever lived in the suburbs?

The whole stigma is that suburbanites are "closed minded," but when I encounter posts like this about how awful the suburbs are, etc, etc... it seems like the urbanites are the closed minded folks.

Some people like the city - some don't. What's the big deal if I desire to move to the suburbs? For raising children, it's fantastic. I had a great childhood, a great community (not a modern development - I grew up in Lansdale), and a great school experience. I want the same for my kids.