PhillyBlog - Philadelphia  

Go Back   PhillyBlog - Philadelphia > Who We Are > Architecture and Urban Planning
Blogs Map Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read
Google
 
Web www.phillyblog.com

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 09-13-2007, 02:29 PM
brooklyncat brooklyncat is online now
Cheesesteak GURU! Wiz with
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,737
Default Vacant Buildings problem

Thought this was interesting -- about the vacant bldgs problem in post-industrial cities.

Note how Philly is cited as a leader in SOLVING this problem, or at least attacking it.

I wonder how much crime can be attributed to all the vacant buildings, although of course there is amazing housing stock that should be saved.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/13/ny...l?ref=nyregion
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 09-13-2007, 02:46 PM
thunda thunda is online now
Cheesesteak GURU! Wiz with
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Souf Street
Posts: 2,101
Default

I assume the reporter is referring to the NTI program when he talks about Philly, but I really wouldn't connect it to the city's "mini renaissance." Most development is happening in areas that were not targeted by NTI. I think the allusion comes from a writer who's not very familiar with Philadelphia taking some quick research that's not too thorough.

My personal opinion, and feel free to disagree, is that if the city had spent the $300 million (or whatever) on improved services and tax cuts, the resulting development would have rehabbed/rebuilt neighborhoods to a much greater extent than NTI has done.
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 09-13-2007, 03:29 PM
brooklyncat brooklyncat is online now
Cheesesteak GURU! Wiz with
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,737
Default

Yes, not particularly well researched. I think they are referring to both NTI AND the private rehabbing that has been going on...but mostly I think there is just a general perception "out there" of a philly renaissance in this area, despite what actual residents think:

“Buffalo can’t be a Philly right now,” said Joe Schilling, the associate director of the Green Regions Initiative in the Metropolitan Institute at Virginia Tech University. The city, he said, “is a lot more isolated.”
Reply With Quote

Advertisement

   
     
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 09-13-2007, 03:30 PM
lighterthief's Avatar
lighterthief lighterthief is offline
Water Ice Vendor
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: East Kensington
Posts: 514
Default

The flaw in NTI is the same problem pointed out in the Buffalo article. It is a checkerboard approach. All the program does is remove the dangerous buildings. It does not provide a vision of what to do next. This type of "Planning" is a method of last resort and comes out of hoplessness. When NTI was started there was much less of a sense of value to Philadelphia Real Estate than there is today. There was no private interest in the properties. The idea was simply remove the hazard and then figure out what to do later.

While I am not really a fan of NTI as it is being applied and it pains me to see buildings demolished there was a need to do something about all of the abandoned buildings. My house is surrounded by "clean and green" land. I probably would not have bought the house if it was surrounded by abandoned collapsing houses. Still I wish the vacant land in my community could be put to some sort of civic purpose rather than be scooped up by speculators who sit on it.
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 09-13-2007, 03:50 PM
zur's Avatar
zur zur is offline
Cheesesteak GURU! Wiz with
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: River Wards
Posts: 13,088
Blog Entries: 2
Default

It's much easier to build on a clean slate... that was the idea if NTI.


Rehabbing a house that needs everything from new brick, roof, foundation, cross members...in a super high crime section?

It's why they are all abandoned in the first place.


Can't save it all.
__________________
"
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 09-13-2007, 04:10 PM
seand's Avatar
seand seand is online now
Cheesesteak GURU! Wiz with
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Cedar Park
Posts: 13,906
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by thunda View Post
I assume the reporter is referring to the NTI program when he talks about Philly, but I really wouldn't connect it to the city's "mini renaissance." Most development is happening in areas that were not targeted by NTI. I think the allusion comes from a writer who's not very familiar with Philadelphia taking some quick research that's not too thorough.

My personal opinion, and feel free to disagree, is that if the city had spent the $300 million (or whatever) on improved services and tax cuts, the resulting development would have rehabbed/rebuilt neighborhoods to a much greater extent than NTI has done.
We have a winner. Also collecting property taxes. We can decide on better social solutions for the small number of poor elderly folks who fall behind on their property taxes but a huge problem in areas with a lot of abdonned buildings is property sepcualtors.

In Philly we do 2 incredibly stupid things:

1. we mark down their taxes for letting their property rot so property speculators have little incentive to "pooh or get off the pot"

2. we don't collect the taxes at all - which makes it even worse.

I hate harp on it yet one more time but does anybody remember where the whole corruption investigation of City Hall spunout of? Investigating Shamsud din Ali who among other things was set up to get a 10% $30K bonus for collecting $300K in back taxes from Chestnut Hill's wealthiest commercial landlord. The contract was bogus because Snowden had already written a check for thefull ammount and given to his councilwoman's aide but City Hall staff conspired to hook Ali up with the bogus "incentive bonus" anyway, aftere the fact. If wealthy landlord Richard Snowden had paid his property taxes on time, he would not have cut a check for $300K at one time, given it Councilperson Donna Reed Miller's chief of staff, and the chief of staff could not have attempted to fraudulently divert the money to a poltical ally.

A lot of local politicians came up and got their political teeth milking Federally funded "urban renewal" programs of teh '70s for every crum of local patronage jobs they can. It shapes their whole idea of how to do urban politics. They liked NTI because it was for them basically the city borrowing massive ammounts of money to do the same thing but with even less Federal accountability.

The problem is to start policies that encourage organic redevelopment and infill (but *gasp* that's close to whats called "gentrification") before most of the buildings in an area are abdonned or run down to the point that we have to tear them all down with tax-payer money.
__________________
A song that says it all.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BqITJFGyq4s

Last edited by seand : 09-13-2007 at 04:18 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 09-14-2007, 04:40 PM
lighterthief's Avatar
lighterthief lighterthief is offline
Water Ice Vendor
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: East Kensington
Posts: 514
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by zur View Post
It's much easier to build on a clean slate... that was the idea if NTI.


Rehabbing a house that needs everything from new brick, roof, foundation, cross members...in a super high crime section?

It's why they are all abandoned in the first place.


Can't save it all.
True, but the demolitions do not automatically bring the vacant land back on the market. The Sheriff Sale system is flawed. There needs to be something AFTER the demolition or all you have is empty lots and hope that the immediate neighbors are civic minded enough to mow.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 09-14-2007, 05:31 PM
talkradiobug talkradiobug is offline
Water Ice Vendor
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 691
Default

Vacant buildings in Philadelphia are just one more excellent argument in favor of LVT, Land Value Taxation.

Many buildings are left vacant because of speculation. LVT would squash most of that and the remainder would mainly be sorted out by market forces. Rest assured that Speculators and landlords will not pay taxes long on vacant property. They will put the land to more productive use.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 09-14-2007, 05:55 PM
seand's Avatar
seand seand is online now
Cheesesteak GURU! Wiz with
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Cedar Park
Posts: 13,906
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by lighterthief View Post
True, but the demolitions do not automatically bring the vacant land back on the market. The Sheriff Sale system is flawed. There needs to be something AFTER the demolition or all you have is empty lots and hope that the immediate neighbors are civic minded enough to mow.
It depends but the demoliton is often ordered by L&I because the buildings is unsafe. In theory they can do this at any time and send the bill the owner that allowed the property to become a threat to public safety. In reaity the L&I building inspections department is severely overworked and only intervenes due to political pressure. Under NTI the city actually footed the bill for the land acquisition, then paid for the demolition, then either gave the land to some CDC or held onto the land.

Usually with a sherrif sale, the contractor organizing the sale for the city just wants to make back the money in lost back taxes and they sell the land as is - whether the building is rehabable or not.

i'm not sure if this is what you are saying but Sherrif's Sales are totally disconnected to the eminent domain land acquisitions under NTI. In my neighborhood, for example, my councilwoman wanted to take some rehabable abdonned buildings and use NTI money to demolish and give the land to a pet CDC. She was mad that people had bought the buildings themselves independently at sherrif's sale with the intention of rehabbing them because the controversy basically put the brakes on her plan to give the land to her pet CDC.
__________________
A song that says it all.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BqITJFGyq4s
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:22 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.